Yes because making it harder for a new player is more inviting to join in the battle community than just having a phantom cap that won't affect them. People are going to have their own opinion, as I have said doesn;t make mine or yours right, Just seeing things differently and I can not see how making it harder for them is inviting in any way!

Oh no 5 players are going to just boost the sit out of one pet! Big deal, I am sure they are probably already one of the high pets anyways, so again that is going to affect who?

EDIT:

Damn double post, move on nothing to see here.

words like 'elitist' are completely redundant when literally everyone will be able to train as much as they want. is it vanity to want huge numbers on my pets? probably. just like it's vanity to want a filled wardrobe or plushie collection or any of the other shit people do on here to get their jollies. doesn't make it any less valid.

It will make it harder as in it would cost more to just simply drop a few grand on csc to trade for sP and buy boosters. It will also instead directly reward them for battling and allow them to continually progress until the cap, instead of fighting everyone 10 times doing 30 BQs a day and having to boost the rest. If someones not interested in putting in the effort to catch up they won't be able to and rightfully so.

except for the fact that those at the top would have a place secured there with minimal effort compared to someone playing catch up it would literally be impossible without tens of thousands of irl money. that's fairly elitist. It's vain and has anegative impact, which I just stated. Those things all have caps as well. You can't have 100k wearables in your wardrobe. There's always a way for someone to catch up slowly over time, where as in battling there would not be.

can you just stop using the word effort I don't think you're grasping the concept

and as for the collections (wears etc) they're only 'capped' by how many items are on site at any given time. there are always new clothes/plushies/etc being released. that's not really a cap. i might actually be wrong about that because i am so unfamiliar with all the other collections, disregard if so.

@ InSaNe AS soon as you provide some compelling evidence as to why that is, I'd be happy to stop. I'm more than willing to change my opinion if I'm convinced, but all these "rebuttals" have done is reaffirm my position. Maybe try putting some more effort into your argument :).

@ cartel Spending a few hours every plot otherwise just doing the daily BQs and the like. I've already said how it's easier to gain more stats when you're at the top than it is otherwise without dropping large amounts of money. The top grows faster than the bottom with the same effort or at the same rate with less effort.

I'm all for the cap being re-evaluated and increased every now and then as need be, the same as how new rare collection items are added every now and then :)

I prefer baseball caps.

Now see a whole new argument has been brought into play. I will have to disagree and say bottle caps are better! Which this board is driving to pop off a bottle cap :P

I think I'd rather read 50 Shades of Gray and/or watch the movie than have a capped pet.

I do not rationally think I can express myself any more than that c:

PS: no currently the only two things on subeta that are hard capped are: pet slots, and pet stat cap. WHAT A PATTERN HM. And people wonder why users laugh hysterically anytime someone calls subeta a pet site.

Naw bro, it's a dress up site with forums, pro-hoarding (hey at least I can hoard here instead of irl am I right??), and a side of extremely controlled and moderated pet experience. IE: everything must be 100% fair at all times and allowing everyone to catch up to everyone else without any true form of competitiveness.

Like really bro, you wanna be the very best? Then why do you want to hold everyone else back, to be the best is to literally be the best-- not have 4093809545 level and a total equal communist styled battle experience. YOU KNOW WHAT WOULD BE REALLY FUN AND TOTALLY FAIR?? All boss battles = 1 point :'D SO THEN NO MATTER HOW STRONG YOUR PET IS IT'S ALL ONE POINT.

There I fixed it.

You keep talking about newbies joining and battling. While no one wants the site to stop growing, you are making alot of blank statements and assumptions.

How many newbies are there joining and battling? A lot of the "new" battlers/face have already been here for years and trained their pet throughout. They just recently decided to actually learn the system.

You also have to take into account flux. Newbies in and veterans leaving.

50 newbies enter, and 1 veteran, lets say X leaves. X has noticeably spend thousands on here to buy Godlies, boosters, whatever. Why would you trade X, a reliable spender, for 50 newbies who, combined, cant be expected to spend as much money as X.

1. Money is good for subeta.
2. Not that many people do it.

Secondly, a lot of loot has been tied to a achievements, theres no point in having an army. Most challenger drops arent really worth having. Only one that comes to mind is PBB. All lower tier loot have reasonable alternatives.

Thirdly, if you want an army, its too late, you are not gonna catch DrJeff or Colddragon. Whats next? capping the amount of capped pets you can have?

Lastly, your arguments on effort eludes me. If you think any of the veterans are not gonna grind for exp given the opportunity you are mistaken. Furthermore, those with stronger pets will be able to grind for exp more than newbies. Idk if you recall but autotrain wasnt always here. Alerts werent always here.

Ppl who have had strong pets long ago, HAD to put in a lot of effort for them. I know I boosted my current main straight through, but i had an OK pet a long time ago that i gave away. Old training sucked.

I thought the main reasons that newcomers are discouraged from battling are the cost of stats and weapons, the time for the pet to be strong enough beat the hardest challenger (who has to be difficult anyways), and also because they simply aren't interested in battling at all. How many people actually cite catching up as the reason they don't like to battle?

I know there are some points in favor of a cap, but tying it to newcomers being discouraged otherwise is a tough sell.

I dunno, the only reason I ever supported the cap was cause I was tired of playing catch up with the opponents, not other players. And the cap was promising to fix that problem. I never really gave a crap about what other battlers could do. I was just sick of barely being able to beat Nightlady one year, and still barely being able to beat her the next cause she got buffed. But now that challengers don't get buffed and we actually get new ones, I don't see how the cap is helping anymore.

I haven't seen anyone say they spend thousands and would leave if there was to continue to be a cap. Given that there are only a few who do so, I doubt that new player spending wouldn't cover that gap and then some, and then with time far surpass it. I've already made arguments for why cap = growth Let's save the hassle of repeating it.

1. agreed 100% I'd rather see csc boosters be more viable, unfortunately the best way for that is to make regular boosters less viable. (aside from intel)
2. my system would encourage it more to a point, that'd come to a stop if someone has no interest in a second pet and also doesn't have any set upgrades to make etc.

I consider spending tens of thousands to catch up only in stats to be outside of reasonable. The top grows faster with a phantom cap, that means that number is going to grow as well. etc etc

That's only one of a few points. I stand by it even if there's not many examples. I'll consider intricate energizzed helm to be another since tokens are easier with multiple pets. Also unstable syringe. And almost all of the other csc challenger loots which covers the entire tier spectrum. forj scrolls, lucky scrolls, etc etc. But I've also made other points for why it encourages growth but we've heard those and probably disagree on them.

It's never too late to have an army, it's only unfeasible if theres a phantom cap unless you accept that you'll never catch up. Besides which the competition is AT the cap, that's where the content will be made for. It's not harder to have a competitive pet because someone has 4, it is harder to have a competitive pet because someone at the top is making money through battling faster than you can through everything combined.

I do sincerely hope veterans stick around and continue to make great efforts. My idea encourages making multiple pets and actually sitting down and battling. Sure a nearly capped pet is going to get faster xp, but then it stops at the cap and it's time to move on to the net one, who at fresh stats is going to be much slower, or at the same mid stats might even be slower since the person with only one pet and mid stats has been focusing on battling with just that pet.

Who's to say someone won't spend money on pet 2/3/4. I'm certainly willing to spend money to have a variety of capped builds. You seem to have exactly the same sentiment. Rocketlauncher has some interesting pets as well :). So that stops until there's no more creative builds to try or until all 45 pets are capped. So 10 years and there's someone with 4 capped pets I think it'll be a while.

I agree 100% that people who've been affected most by the cap are the people who worked the hardest to get there. I don't think that's a point against there being a cap. I think it's a product of an evolving game that has made some good positive changes to encourage people to get in to battling.

But still what is the reason that having a phantom cap will make subeta, as a whole, or even just battling as a whole, better?

if it hasn't been said directly you proved it indirectly in your statements. the costs of stats is only going to go up without a cap. I for one would be focusing near solely on my main pet, so there's at least one extra useful item drop from each opponent that has one that won't be sold to a new battler and since there's supply and demand curve and all that, consider other ones will be higher priced as well.

If that's a tough sell for a cap. What's a good reason for not having one?

who's actually spent ten thousand+ dollars on a pet here? genuinely asking. thousands? maybe. tens of thousands? i'm gonna need some sauce with that.

[edit]

Don't say that or they'll get wise to me slow and steady okay

I have in fact spent several, several, thousands on subeta and I've spent about... $10 on battling outside of the CS challengers, which I beat approx 5 times and then lose all of my interest, since I've capped.

That's coming from a person who literally spent $50 on one copy of this bad boy: ie: someone who's got expendable money to burn and STILL finds battling a waste of money at this point.

Now I just train up my army with zero motivation to actually go an extra inch, let alone a mile. There's no reason to cap more than one. There's no reason to make interesting builds when everything will always be exactly like it is today.

There will never be anything stronger or more interesting being there CAN'T be. Oh boy oh goody gumdrops I cannot WAIT to see if my slightly different stated pet can get one more win on something than the twelve other pets I capped before it.

Zzzz. If I was going to waste that much time or dedication I'd probably save for a classic godly, it'd probably do me a lot more good than more capped pets winning me achievement based loot.

Fo' sure, I keep up with the book collection and every time I turn around there's another one and I know the others are just as bad.

You can't hide your army! ;)

But I'm trying! Just you have fun trying to find them in that cluster of 46 pets! BWaahaha.

I didn't really want to set foot in here because I have a tiny pet and with the amount of battling I haven't been doing since... forever, it's not exactly my place to be discussing this. But here's a wall of text anyway.

Once upon a time, I was a newbie who had some interest in battling because of potentially interesting drops from big guys and hey, I have had/still have fun with battling on other sites/games. I guess you can still consider me a newbie, since I haven't moved on with my original battling "project".

So, while I have little grounds for discussing certain BD mechanics, maybe I can say something about being a battle newbie who "gave up". As one of those, what I saw (and still see) is that I will need to train a lot, boost a lot, spend a lot of sp/csc to try getting a decent armory set and it will likely take me years to accomplish such a feat. Ok, I get that. Then, when I will be there, when I will have put such an incredible effort towards reaching the end of this long road, I will have but a CHANCE to be able to beat the hardest challengers. That's mostly because they seem to rely -this- heavily on certain weapons to get beaten. Don't get me wrong, I love the idea of a community, I find it great that weapons can technically be lent around, but I hate how weapons I can't buy or earn seem to be so essential to hit what was supposed to be endgame.

As a newbie, as things are right now, this seems a dead end road. I'm going to reach the end, but I'm never going to reach endgame, because endgame wasn't built for me. Was built for the other guys who were there before me and have options I don't and can't get. Yeah, I see the newbie argument behind a cap, but I find it to be inefficient because it wasn't there from the beggining and because of the current weapons pool. From an outsider's point of view, reaching a certain capped stat level seems to be merely an illusion of catching up, the gap is still insurmountable to my eyes.

Call me lazy if you will, but for me endgame shouldn't require the exact right build (why is reassigning stats an impossible thing?), incredible amounts of patience and, if you don't have the right weapons, luck + a wicked good strategy, which is how it seems to be now. Doesn't mean it shouldn't require strategy at all, or be attainable in 5 seconds, but this is pushing things to a whole another dimension. Of course, I don't even want to address boss battles; I can't call off my daily duties to sit and battle 24h for, again, a -chance- at something. I'm glad it's out of my league so I don't have to feel like I should.

In the end, it seems less frustrating and more economical if I save up all that currency I'd be spending in training, buy the loot I may want instead (provided it's not another weapon) and take my battling fun to these other games/sites. Especially if you consider that most of the time, during those years you're working towards the end of the road, the battle drops don't even seem to be valuable enough to offer decent compensation for the effort required. Maybe that has changed now with the new BQs, but I haven't tried them yet.

For the sake of it, I don't have a fixed opinion on cap or no cap, but if cap, then I think I'd want one that goes above the challengers' cap, so that a person could go godless. If no cap, then, as a newbie, I can tell it won't affect me if there are people with 999999 in each stat, provided we're still playing on the same grounds and they'll be scaled down for boss battles. As I see it, I won't NEED to catch up to them. Why would I?

I don't find comparisons to other areas of the site to be that helpful -- I believe collections were always capped in the sense that we always knew only official items would get in on it -- but it might be worth a mention that the wardrobe collection is capped, but the wardrobe itself isn't. We have custom wearables.

Here goes what could be a relevant comparison: if I need something to dress, I don't need to tear my hair off trying to find the perfect layering anymore, and that's IF it even exists. I can just go and make it, or have someone make it for me. It actually improved my game experience by a lot. It's not a game breaker for anyone else, since they can buy mine/make their own too. And it's not a game breaker for people who can't afford any, since the actual wardrobe collection is capped. I guess it's like our own phantom cap, lol.

It would be nice to have a day where newbies felt like they could reach endgame and still do things with weapons they could reasonably achieve, even if having worse weapons force them to train longer. That's something I think would be beneficial for the community.

That was a very well worded, honest and thought out post. All voices should be heard.