I wanted to start off thanking you guys for having another war this year. I was disappointed last year when we didn't get one, so this was great.

Not listed in any order of significance, just what came to mind first:

Pros:

1. New loot - Yay new loot on all of the challengers. really glad to see that.
2. Boss waves - breaking up the monotony is really good. I hate ignoring my family for a weekend so I can play a game, so giving waves with breaks in between are very handy so I can at least try to give them some attention.
3. Boss time announced ahead of time - really appreciate this. I wish it could have been announced sooner and in a more public place (for the first wave)
4. Prize distribution for tiers - I really liked seeing how the cores went to the top place in each tier. Maybe next war, include more specifics on how prizes will be distributed so even smaller pets will know they should try for as many wins as possible. I feel like a lot of smaller pets don't contribute as much because they don't think it will matter. I think said something about tier prizes ahead of time, but in the news comments.

Cons:

1. no new achievements - I loved the gelatin war because of the achievements, but this year, I only needed hydragellos ones (which I still didn't get). the new loot provided some motivation to battle the challengers, but not to the same extent as other people.
2. limited numbers on challengers - I just wonder why they're still limited by number? it's not like we get points for beating them or anything (though this would be cool). every wave of new challengers came with people in the comments section saying "oh I missed them" with varying degrees of upsetness. I just don't see why limiting them is still necessary.
3. Boss Wave Structure - I saw various people complaining about how long the waves were. Some people felt it was too short, others felt like they were too long. it boiled down to if you actually fought the whole time. if you missed the battling "oh the waves weren't long enough", but if you didn't miss the battling and you fought the whole time "way too long" I feel like having multiple waves is only beneficial if each wave is identical and the score you get is from your best wave. this would allow for more shorter waves so people don't feel like it's necessary to battle the entire time. I personally battled the whole time and woke up at 3 am for wave 2, so I battled (slowly) until 9:30 am when the boss finally died. I feel like people wouldn't miss the waves if the times were announced further ahead of time. of course there are people that will still miss them, but you can't accommodate everyone. The long waves that are added together encourage users to fight the entire time, which was about 12 hours of sitting in one place clicking a few buttons. Obviously we aren't being "forced" to sit and fight, but it's encouraging us sitting in one spot and fighting the entire time like having achievements for number of unique items encourages gallery hoarding. As long as there is some benefit for doing it, people will do it.
4. Prizes for top in tier execution - So I didn't realize how not competitive other tiers were. it is to the point where I decided to list this as a con too. I saw a pet in the top 10 of tier 1 with 4 losses. 4 losses. 4. losses. Getting a top prize (well except the core) for 4 losses is crazy to me, if I could have gotten all my prizes for 4 losses, I would have gotten another 11 and a half hours of sleep that day. I feel like the top in tier prizes are a good idea, don't get me wrong on that, but I don't think they should have been given out in the quantity that they were if there were some pets that really didn't try hard (though congrats to the people who did battle with their t1 pet and got these prizes, I bet that is a huge surprise! I wish I had trained a t1 pet a bit and done the same thing at this point). The tier prizes are supposed to be effort prizes. Cores going out to tier 1 don't really make sense to me, and with the top prize going out to the lowest tiers, some battlers will probably now grind with a low tier pet because the top tiers are the most competitive ones, which undermines the thought of tier prizes. it just doesn't make sense that the stronger you are, the tougher it is to get a good prize. at some point we have to look at what do we want from the people who don't like battling / haven't started to battle yet / are too lazy to train their pet (to put it a bit bluntly). should they be rewarded the same as someone with a tier 13 pet who has put years of training and millions if not billions of sP into training that? they have the same opportunities to train their pet all year round, battling once a year during a boss to get a top prize defeats the purpose in my opinion.

subject to additions. just wanted to get my opinion out there though I feel like a lot of people already know how I feel about these wars. feel free to post what you liked/didn't like about the gelatin war

it's exactly how I feel! thanks for writing this :)

About "limited numbers on challengers" - you are totally right, it would be great if instead of the limit to we would have a task to beat X number of each challenger to get global prizes, like the quests challenge that we had.

Beat 50k minis - get a titles Beat 25k gliders - get an achievment and so on Do X damage to Hydra - 1 pet slot.

Oooh, I like 's ideas! It would give people more of an incentive to continue to fight the other ones even after they already have their achievements.

Although with the boss battle taking so much dedication too, maybe some would still rather hold off and save their energy for that.

I've already posted my opinion in the BC chat but may as well repeat for visibility:

1. The top 10 prizes thing per tier is a bit eh. It really squeezes the mid-top tiers imo. They have no chance of getting a core, but the competition is fierce regardless. If you're in the high tiers, like t11 to low t13, I think it'd be sensible to build a dedicated small pet for future events if we continue this way. Just pump AP, because scrolls are broken, and pump strength to get the most bang for your buck. Should be easy to get top 10s. I like that lower tiers have incentives to battle to the top. But you're penalised if you're sat in the middle at the moment, imo, considering the lack of unique prizes. Would be good to see the number of top tier rewards scaled more generously across the tiers.

2. The whole thing was super short. I think we needed more time imo, particularly when you need to crush 2,500 minis for the achievement. I understand that, for many, this wouldn't be achievable in a single war. But there was hardly a chance to breathe this time! I think 2 days for the minis, 2 days for the gliders, 1 day for the golem, 1 day for the gelashell, 1 day for the wizard and then 3 days for hydra. I was away from Friday evening to Sunday evening and was so lucky to catch the dual gelashell/wizard release just before I left the house on Friday. Algebra can crush them easily, thankfully, but I can imagine it far more stressful to try and condense a struggle for 10 wins with the wiz and hydra fights and other achievements.

3. The global boss battle was the worst in a long while imo. I think the numbers speak for themselves; 1k is a big step down vs the 5k on Kiyo, as has been observed. The duration was just far far too short. Real life prevented me from getting a single battle in when I've hit 150 minimum on the past few global boss fights. And I'm not saying the site should base it around me! But this was obviously a common problem. I really don't see the harm in making these two 24 hour events, or 3 8 hour events, spread across multiple days. Choice is good! 12 hours - on a Saturday evening and Sunday morning - is just not enough time over a weekend when you have plans, family and partners to manoeuvre around etc. It's enough if you want to battle through the whole thing I spose, but that represents a small slice of the battlers.

BUT I realise I see this from my biased, prizeless point of view. So grain of salt.

I agree with this, it'd probably be easier to get a core with a t3 pet or something if you knew what you were doing. tier 13 pets didn't get to double dip, top t13 pet only got one core, I'm sure the top t12 pet was in the same boat.

I normally don't get onto Subeta on the weekends, and it's totally my fault because I KNEW they hydragellos was coming, but I am disappointed that I wasn't able to get a single hit in. Normally I always try and battle what I can, just to do it, and I've yet to miss a battle like this.

I do wish there was some other way than "well, if you're on, congrats, you get to play" though. I wish there was more than two waves (just because this is the "biggest of the bad"). Idk if it would be better or worse to say, hey, fight X for two days, then Y for two days, then Z for two days, that way no matter what time zone you're in, or (hopefully) what days you can play, you have a better shot at getting a chance to fight.

Why do we even do this in waves anymore? We have a new system, with tiers and everything. Why do we NEED the final blow anymore? (Even though it IS cool to get it.) This, again, is more just sheer dumb luck than anything. It would be nice to try something new, just for the sake of finding out what works better.

Edit: got my sentiments out better lol. I like and agree with the staggering of opponents for multiple days.

I really like awarding the top per tier, it's really nice to see people who may not yet have trained their pets or been on Subeta very long still have a chance to get a big headstart in terms of building their armory / a reward.

I do feel really bad for people who stayed up for many hours with really decent pets who /just/ missed out. It would really have been nice for a new item to have been introduced so that people who worked hard wouldn't have felt like it was fruitless, because chances are, a lot of the battlers would have won the older items before.

As posed on BCC before, I think it would be interesting to see boss battles that are reduced in hours required, eg. Hydra was out for roughly 12 hours, which is a big commitment to ask. I know technically we don't have to do the full 12 hours, but anyone who doesn't try for the full 12 hours may feel they have a significantly reduced chance at a top tier prize, or will feel like they are missing out etc.

I would really like a future event to trial a multi-wave boss where only the top damage in a wave counted towards the top prize so there's a limit to the hours doing the same boring thing. I don't think this would disadvantage committed people with smaller pets given there are top per tier awards too :)

Gonna go out on a limb here, but is there any particular reason why a prize shop is not considered for the gelatin war? I mean, every method of prize distribution has its pros and cons, but I'm genuinely curious.

I'd rather have the option to buy the book x6 instead of getting loot that I personally have no use for (sticker, beanbag, plushie).

I fully agree about doing away with the final hit mechanic. I posted on the BC thread some pages back, but essentially, my idea was this:

• Give boss infinite health, since damage should only matter anyways (connects with the last listed reason down below)
• Boss leaves once in awhile, thus creating multiple waves for various users of time zones to get some fighting in. Waves can be anywhere from 3-5 hours, with half an hour break time in between waves.
• Boss fight times are announced and listed, and the boss will finally leave, say, 3 days later.
• No more final hit mechanic BS

I guess I have a question: why don't we get to know how the prizes/points/etc are going to be counted ahead of time? Why are boss battles shrouded in mystery? I couldn't get a clear answer whether or not my T4 pet doing 0 damage at the end was worth battling more, it would have been nice to know how it worked ahead of time. It seemed like we were encouraged to spend a lot of time battling but I don't think putting another hour or two in would have gotten me more prizes, and I wasn't contributing anything to actually bringing down the boss in the end.

I'm fine with prizes, they seem reasonable for the short length of the event. I knew I wasn't going to put hours in ahead of time, so for my sporadic participation the prizes are good.

Nice to see an NPC hanging out in comments during the event.

YES. !00% agree on everything you said.

I really do like the idea of smaller waves over X days, though I don't agree with only the highest scoring wave should be counted. It should be some sort of combination, so if you can play here and there, your efforts are rewarded. (Say there ends up being 10 waves over 3 days. Scoring should be, for example, your three highest hitting waves. So you can play all 10 if you can manage, but only the top 3 will count. Or, you can simply play 3 waves and be done with it.)

Speaking of scoring, has a point. I've never known how the scores are tallied. If you hit for 200, and it heals for 300, are you getting a 0 score? Or does the 200 count as 200 no matter what? Is there a market in here to give you an additional 10 or 100 or 1000 points for every battle fought? Lots of mechanics here to play around with, that I hope the team takes into consideration.

your score is the damage you do to them, not his net health change. so in your example where you hit for 200 and it heals for 300, you get 200 damage.

I think having a single best wave makes the most sense, when you start having more waves and require a certain number of them to count towards your score, you're getting to the point where that isn't a huge improvement to what we have now.

I'd like to see a pirates vs islanders style battle come back eventually where you fight challengers and gain points. I missed out on that one.

Thanks for that info.

If scoring is only ever going to be based of a single best wave, then it would be nice if the waves were shorter. Grinding away for 2-3 hours straight is doable for most people. 6, 8, 12, not so much. has the right idea: infinite health, lasting 2-3 days, and only being available in short spurts, with like hour breaks in between waves.

it definitely is a bit confusing your first boss or two. shorter identical timed waves is something I've been pushing for for awhile now :x

Can someone explain why we got the Jelly wars IN THE MIDDLE OF ANOTHER SITE EVENT?

Seriously, this should have been done either the week before, or the week after the item drive. Not at the same time.

Idk I don't think they really interfered with each other. Donating items is so low-key, and doesn't require a lot of interaction. It might have been nice to have Babbette or another NPC comment on the jellies. Make them seem a little less random. But they weren't a hassle to have both going on.

I like that the items were based on damage, and then some extra items for the top ten per tier. I think that was a good idea.

What I'd love personally is a damage counter during the boss battle, maybe don't have it reset with each new fight? This might not be possible, but I'd like to know.

I think a prize shop would fit boss battles very well. Having the points be calculated with damage, f.e. 1000 damage = 1 point and choose the prizes so that T5-T8 could earn the core if they were really dedicated in all boss fights and that T11-T13, who already dedicated themself to training and battle quests, could earn all items after dedicating themselves to one battle, with being able to farm for another one if they'd rather stay awake and continue fighting.

I'd just prefer it if there was some sort of set goal that you can achieve, but I guess that would kinda ruin the competetive aspect wouldn't it? It would just be more enjoyable knowing how much your effort really matters.

Or maybe instead of always doing 'most damage' try switching it up to 'quickest to 1M damage' or 'most damage in a single round'. Just switching it up a little.

I don't know though, this was my first real boss battle fight so that are just my rookie opinions. I'm also a big fan of that multiple waves idea where only your strongest one counts.

And yet, we're going to get another six weeks of "nothing happens" over the summer. That's just bad pacing.

All my salt has been posted before and I agree with , etc. I was really upset and I still am, but that's what I get either way. I'll either use my lower tier next time, learn to be a better battler or just sit it out to avoid disappointment.

I overall hate how bosses are handled/awarded.

A prize shop would be a nice idea, that way you're rewarded for your effort rather than in comparison to everyone else's efforts.

I can see how a damage counter, or anything that says your cumulative damage total really, would help out smaller battlers that are confused about boss battles. I had no understanding of the concept of boss battles until Kiyo last year and I see a lot of people are still confused by this.

I have to mention that I don't like items being handed out by tier. I see several people already having had or are planning to take advantage of this by battling with multiple pets to grab more prizes for themselves from less competitive tiers. Maybe we should be limited to battling a boss with one designated battle pet or do away with tier-based prizes altogether.

I don't like having the ability to get prizes on multiple pets either really, especially top prizes. I think just whichever pet does the best, you can only get one set of prizes makes the most sense. That way, seasoned battlers don't knock out possibly less knowledgeable and seasoned pets.