I decided to start a topic here because people are still making comments on the news post but it takes forever to get the page to load because of all the 504 errors.

My main complaint - people have been begging and pleading for sheer gloves for the other arm for years but the artists never have time to do these. They did, however, find time to do artwork for weapons which only a small number of players could ever afford to wear.

redacted

Most of these weapons were already wearable, so I'm not sure where the debate is...

The thread is a splendid idea - just not as many will participate as in a News Comments, I'm afraid. And most has been said there already, I guess.

In addition to rambling on in the news comments, as thoughts came to my mind...

Re preserving people's investment:

I once bought a 1-year GA for the sole purpose of the newly added extra Battle Quests, because my pet had kept dropping on and from the Top Ten list without them. Half a year later that perk was taken away and I was stranded with the rest of now for me useless GA time, which I had wasted real life money on! Nobody ever even replied or reacted to my complaints! But needless to say that was the last time I spent real money on the site :-(

I've spent much too much time here all those years, working hard to eventually meet my goals, but obviously this will never suffice or be enough, since what I have achieved/gained/bought is turned "worthless" (look at the Fanciful Box contents) and what has been on my list for ever and a day drifts ever further away :-(

I already commented on the original post with my thoughts, but I did see this reply from staff this morning and I wanted to comment on it;

CWs are user submitted. The time and resources to do 90% of the work is USER RUN. And the original point of CWs was to make exclusive items for just you or your friends. (CWs are also catering to a smaller market, and users aren't staff and not trying to create an entire economy!)

Battling was never (As far as I can find! Correct me if I'm wrong please!) meant to be for an exclusive set of your friends. It was supposed to be for the entire site to join and participate in.

Also please. Please stop using CWs as a way to justify everything staff gets backlash against. It's okay to have ideas that flop and upset the community-- it'll help you guys learn how to do something different next time. But don't put it on the CW community for no reason lmao.

Can the old opponents from plots/events be put into the cash shop so that players who weren't around then (and ones that didn't have a battle pet back then) can battle and obtain these weapons/scrolls the same way those players obtained them? All I want is a fair chance at winning them too! I am not asking for anything to be handed to me. I am willing to battle for them. I trained my pet until he capped so that I could participate in plots/events and fight high level opponents only to find out that some of them don't give out the same items they used to give out. How is that fair? If I fight the same opponent, then I should get the same items. That was the goal I worked towards. It always makes me question why I bothered. Not really sure what else to say beside what I posted in the news comments. My final thought on this is that players who own these weapons/scrolls need to realize that a lot of players are losing interest in this site. Things need to change before it is too late. I hate typing that out because it makes me sad, but that is the harsh reality! When enough people get fed up and leave, the site wont be able to last too long. If the site falls then those "investments" wont be worth anything. They will go poof along with the site. You can't take it with you. Once again I hope my rant/opinions don't upset anyone. I tend to keep to myself because I worry about upsetting someone. I truly hope you all have a wonderful day 🌈

Event prizes should really just retired and fade out of existence and never get a rerelease. Sure people will cry about not getting X weapon or wearable, how its not fair, or it costing trillions to buy from other players, but it's really the cleanest solution.

Instead, refocus attention to making new weapons, prizes, improving the system & UI, etc. I feel new things will excite people way more than trying to work and manage relics of the past.

I’m not sure why everyone is under the impression that the items in the godly fanciful box were ever won by battling opponents.

Asking to re-release them in the way they were first released is asking for a restock war where 50 times more people than Subeta currently has take part in, and then give it to just the top 2 people. Yeah, amazing.

Or let’s re-release them the way they were released the second time: in the crystal shop where they sold out in <2 minutes because 3-4 users (not even battlers mind you) bought most of the stock as there were no restrictions.

That would not be more fair for sure.

There are 1600 weapons and 50,000 unique items on Subeta, but you’re losing interest because of 8 items you cannot buy yet, don’t need to beat any opponents, and may have to save up for. Really?

The price for these remained stable over the years, I don’t know what people are suddenly surprised of. It was 100-150k csc equiv in 2009 and it is now in the hustler box for about that much, sP just inflated in the meantime. Some sold for up to 3 times that, and all staff did was cap that down to a fairer value and release them again so it isn’t dependant on older users having to part with theirs anymore.

As for the cheaper box, most items in it were 1-2-3 billion and up, now released en masse for 125m a pop to increase the amount in circulation. It’s helping newer players get what they missed before.

Subeta was neither fairer or easier in the past, you need to stop fetishizing over it

My only main complaint is Subeta staff knew gacha mechanics were bad much earlier on when they changed monthly collections to where you can pick what you want out of the box. Why bring it back?

I don't know if that was a direct response to my post, but I don't think you read my full message and understood it if it was.

I don't care if OG godlies ever got rereleased and inflated up to 100b a pop and I was never able to obtain them ever again. I can definitely afford to go after what i'm missing and make a choice not to.

I do care that: 1.) Every other item gets re-released and devalued.
2.) The pace at which this was released.....if you were offline for a 24 hour period you missed out on the Fanciful. I purchased 2 From the Hustler and 4 from other people so this doesn't apply to me but I am all for a chance for all users (even a small chance). 3.) In this stagnant battling area.....a brand new weapon gets locked behind a 9 billion sP RNG Box with very limited time restrictions and no heads up for this style.
There have been countless suggestions on the battle community on ways to release new weapons that require no new programming....and again...this is how it was released. 4.) If everything is about retaining value, obviously they need assistance how setting up pricing to release things (at least at the hype) because there's ways to price it without things selling out in 5 minutes (Like the Fanciful boxes did). 5.) The frequent inconsitencies in how items get screwed over. Restock war prizes have gone out in other ways and sucks (especially as someone whose won a restock war).

I think the perception came from being able to get gods from battle related means or special shops lately. Manifesting Weapon is a god that comes from beating Roland. Cronos from beating Meat Slab. ME and MSH are made from/are Gel War prizes. TKSS is a battle prize from Skelly plot. Wrath and SoSS are in the antique shop and Ether and Natasha are in the MC. So it was thought that if old gods returned, they would be from similar things.

And something about a promise from staff about O-staff returning to the Crystal Shop after it sold out so fast the first time. I don't remember that but it was quoted a lot in the news comments.

I wasn't specifically replying to anyone, but let's go over your questions anyway:

1. Both boxes did just that
2. Yeah, I think the Fanciful could have been handled better. IDK why people were able to buy 2 a day or why the restock was spread over only 24 hours. That being said, there will always be people missing out on things that are limited in supply
3. It's not just a brand new weapon, it's a weapon statted like a God weapon, which means it could be in the same price range. We haven't had an OG in a decade, most alternatives are much much cheaper, so where's the fuss. Everyone gets to enjoy their own metagame. There were also two other new releases for much cheaper, and weapons are released every now and then for much less. This is just one.
4. Are we complaining about weapons being released for too cheap or too expensive? you cannot have it both ways. The price of the cheaper box stuff will go back up soon enough as supply and demand takes over. Now there's more supply, which is exactly people are asking for.
5. What do you mean by screwd over? Do you want things to be released cheaper, or only things you don't own? God weapon owners saw their stuff decrease by 10-15 billion in value, each. Can anyone claim they lost more? I'm happy the supply increased and more people now get to also enjoy them, not bitter over the loss of value. Not everything can cost 10k, especially when hundreds and hundreds of users have billions of sP just burning a hole in their pocket with nothing to spend it on. There has to be goals that are harder to attain than others.

I managed to get into the news comments so here are two quotes relating to this.

and the reply to this

If an artist can fly through all those overlays for weapons in less than 24 hours, why can't we have items like the sheer gloves for the other arm?

I wasn't specifically replying to anyone, but let's go over your questions anyway:

1. Both boxes did just that
2. Yeah, I think the Fanciful could have been handled better. IDK why people were able to buy 2 a day or why the restock was spread over only 24 hours. That being said, there will always be people missing out on things that are limited in supply
3. It's not just a brand new weapon, it's a weapon statted like a God weapon, which means it could be in the same price range. We haven't had an OG in a decade, most alternatives are much much cheaper, so where's the fuss. Everyone gets to enjoy their own metagame. There were also two other new releases for much cheaper, and weapons are released every now and then for much less. This is just one.
4. Are we complaining about weapons being released for too cheap or too expensive? you cannot have it both ways. The price of the cheaper box stuff will go back up soon enough as supply and demand takes over. Now there's more supply, which is exactly people are asking for.
5. What do you mean by screwd over? Do you want things to be released cheaper, or only things you don't own? God weapon owners saw their stuff decrease by 10-15 billion in value, each. Can anyone claim they lost more? I'm happy the supply increased and more people now get to also enjoy them, not bitter over the loss of value. Not everything can cost 10k, especially when hundreds and hundreds of users have billions of sP just burning a hole in their pocket with nothing to spend it on. There has to be goals that are harder to attain than others.

1.) Fair point I can see that argument, but the discrepancy in pricing as a % of the items pre Hustler Box compared to the Cost of the relative Hustler box are very disproportionate.

2.) Agreed, but with the frequency of token shops and Crystal Shop restocks (Which have already gone through this process with rereleasing a lot of these items before and negative feedback) its pretty straight forward how the user base would react to how this was handled. This could have easily been changed to give a broader userbase a chance.

3.) Fair point, but this could have been handled with a better roll out. The user base as a whole is always asking for more communication. This could have gotten a much better user reaction had this had a subtle announcement (i.e. waiting until 9/5 when the shop was fully coded and completed to announce signs of the Hustler setting up a new shop with a soft opening scheduled to start on [Insert Date]. This could have been rolled out to test rereleasing different items that are much less volatile vs. the Crystal Shop / Token Shop for a period of time.

4.) Two different issues: A.) I'm complaining about the fanciful box being priced too cheap for existing weapons. Depending on how the future of these boxes go - it can impact the sale of every non godly that could potentially go in the boxes for some items people worked hard for. Many of which I may not have and could benefit from (which i'm against). B.) New weapons being released in limited quantities for sP - which I don't think has ever happend (For Both Boxes). Agreed things go back to everyones goals, but not everyones goal is hoarding sP.

5.) I'm just for things to be relative and consistent. I don't even have a TKSS or Martenez Briefcase - I'm all for fairness and not wanting any of these upper tier weapons to devalue disproportionately - even the ones I obtained. I'm all for your point of goals and not everything being easily obtainable. As the BA's have stressed, there are plenty of Millionaire center items out there. There are dozens of easily buyable items or weapons that are set and can be earned as goals.

If I'm the minority and this is the new standard....thats great....but again consistency. Let people work towards a goal of obtaining 9b sP (adj for inflation) to try and be ready for the next time a brand new godly pops into the shop. Not one time a restock war.....one time lets dump it into the antique shop....and maybe crystal shop.

[edit] To be clear - I totally appreciate the attempt by the Battle Admins. None of this was done with poor intention, their decisions cant please everyone, and I don't know whats in store for future events and releases.

I also don't know how the Fanciful Boxes will change over time since they will be rereleased as prizes. [/edit]

Since I was around for all the news comments, I'm just going to copy and paste my last comment to help give context for people that weren't able to read them all since I've already seen a lot of misunderstanding and misinterpretation in general. Please note that as much as I'd like to be, I'm not a true battler so all of my understanding of some battlers' issues with the boxes comes entirely from the news comments. Please elaborate on anything I've mentioned to add more context/clarity if you know more about it!

The main problem is that staff have specifically stated here in these comments that they did the re-release this way to protect the "investment" of people who already have godlies. This makes no sense because no other groups of people anywhere on Subeta get their "investments" protected. Everything can be re-released and generally speaking, Subeta has done a decent job of that. You might spend tens of millions on an item to have it devalued a week later, but that's how its always been. Except for the teeny tiny percentage of battlers who own godlies, apparently. People are extremely upset to see this very tiny group of users receiving special treatment that no group has ever gotten before.

Additionally, many battlers are upset about the way these items were re-released and released. They've wanted to be able to earn their godlies just like people did in the past. There are a lot of ways that have been suggested for this such as Crystal Shop stocks (as promised by staff 10 years ago), loot from an opponent, achievements, or being in the Battle Shop. No one ever wanted loot boxes. Especially not loot boxes that cost over $1,000 USD.

Another problem is that staff have been teasing about a battling event for quite a while. Battlers have been really excited about this. Some have been working on their pets and weapon/scroll sets in preparation. The "event" turned out to be insanely expensive loot boxes. This is extremely disappointing for anyone who was even a little excited about an actual battle event or plot happening. People feel very cheated with staff getting their hopes up so high for this.

The wearable issue you're seeing is not that a rare, expensive wearable was released. The problem comes from the fact that staff have been saying for years how limited their resources are. We've gotten almost no pets and less items due to this shortage. People are upset to see these extremely limited resources being used on an extremely rare weapon. People who buy these items to battle with are not going to be moving them back and forth from their wardrobe to their battle set. This means that the art that went into the wearable overlay was a waste. The overlay is beautiful and people want to use it, but in reality its quite likely that no one is ever going to. That's poor allocation of Subeta's limited resources.

The conversation kind of morphed and many people expressed their desire to battle but their frustration at both the mechanics of the system and how the whole department is run (in regards to weapon re-releases, battle admin power, etc). A lot of long-term dedicated users shared frustrations and made suggestions about how to improve battling and make it more welcoming for total newbies and newbies to battling specifically. Based on the battle admins' comments here, a lot of people feel very alienated and like they're not welcome in battling because they're not already elite battlers. People have been expressing those frustrations as well.

Another problem is that there have been some extremely condescending and rude replies from staff in the news comments in general. This has upset quite a few people and as someone who got one of those nasty replies, it hurt. Aside from maybe a small handful of comments, users have been really polite and provided some genuinely great insight into and suggestions on how to address the issues they're having. It feels like staff don't care about this at all as instead of responding to any of those messages, they've been replying only to tiny snippets of comments, taking things personally, and making vague-Tweet esque comments in response to users' valid concerns.

honestly at this point I don't even care that they released a 1200$ USD gambling box, but the flippant and honestly insulting way the mod was responding to valid criticism (if they didn't just completely ignore it or only listen to a single throwaway point while brushing off the entire rest of the reply, see acorn bombs) is absolutely obnoxious.

I don't think the BAs were aware that acorn bombs hadn't been re-released in some time. i don't know when they were made edible for gourmands (who would seriously eat a bomb though??). But since that was given the go ahead to RR, the acorns are out again.

to paraphrase the following comments, "it's not about the acorn bombs, it was never about the acorn bombs!"

But it is a start in addressing the bigger problems.

Good They needed to recirculate a lot of these weapons. Who knows how many are even on active accounts anymore. “ThEy’Re NoT nEeDeD fOr EnDgAmE” No, they’re not. But a lot of them make battles much easier. Recirculating these weapons while also implementing an sp sink was a good idea.

Bad There’s a lot. I’ll just add one thing to avoid a lengthy post. There should have been a hard timer on those small boxes. 24-48 hours between each buy. There’s no reason someone should have 4 boxes while others had none.