The Hustler has been acting extra shifty lately. Maybe you should investigate...
In a completely unrelated note, an important weapons shipment mysteriously "went missing" this afternoon. We managed to salvage a few Fanciful Boxes that were overlooked in the theft, and will be holding those for future battle event prizes. Unfortunately, everything else appears to be long gone.
"they're meant to be a status symbol" Lol I really don't understand that at all. I like battling and trained my battle pet until he capped. Even I don't really know much about "Godly" weapons and I have no clue who owns what weapons. How is it a status symbol if (I am pretty sure) most of us don't even know that they own it? I don't hang around the battle chat so I have no clue who the top battlers even are. Out of the all the players that own these weapons, how many are still active players that actually play the site beyond checking in once a year? How many of these weapons are stuck on frozen or abandoned accounts? Personally I don't really understand the desire for these overpriced weapons. My T13 pet does just fine with the few weapons I have earned along the way. So far I have been able to beat every challenger at least 5 times for the loot. I may struggle a little on a couple, but I just buy throwing vials and keep plugging away until I succeed. Hopefully my ramblings don't upset anyone. I just want to play the site and have fun <3
No, definitely not saying that! Each of the godlies is worth (more than) 9b. But if people could choose, of course they'd go for the best godly and the newest one over all the others. I'm sure the others would sell, but there would be a lot of complaining about how only the first 10 lucky people managed to snag the most sought-after stuff.
oh no I forgot to fix the typo-
Honestly, stop turning the ones that you want limited releases of to be duel purpose.
Decided to bold it so Staff can see it better.
-- I know, I was just being silly. I love the folks on here too, even the disgustingly wealthy ones.
Oh well if KEITH helped you guys design the new lootbox system that has a lootbox currently pricing to $1,180USD worth of SP points, I guess we should all just suck it up and be happy, right? LMAO.
I just think it's stupid to make very attractive wearable art for an item that you only want to go to 5 people. Like, really, really stupid. If someone makes a similar CW to that spork as someone else brought up, I'd grab one for sure. No way in heck I'd even consider dropping 9bil on a friggin' chance at a wearable I want.
I honestly wouldn't be so upset if they were just weapons. I would be annoyed still, but I wouldn't use them so it wouldn't apply to me so much. The thing that really upsets me is having 5 sporks go out when the sporks have an amazing overlay. You keep making weapons that have appeal outside of battling as a wearable and only 5 people can get them? That's bullshit.
Honestly, stop turning the ones that you want limited releases of to be duel purpose! Or at least make knock offs aren't weapons so the rest of us can enjoy it too. I wouldn't give a fuck if only a couple of people had a spork if it wasn't a kick ass wearable too.
This was what was getting at. We have limited resources right now and overlays are going to items that nobody can wear on site because there are only a handful in existence.
normally i'm all for the downfall of capitalism but subeta users are the sweetest and some of the most generous people are on this site. i appreciate our tiny community and the eagerness to share wealth. i do disagree with the protection/favoring of a very, very small portion of the userbase's investments. this is of no fault to the users, of course. i hope we can find a solution and find more ways to make the community interact instead of eating the rich l o l
"Barring a total rehaul of the system to make it more intuitive and less needing a 20 page guide and an oldie to walk us through it, I don't have any suggestions for battling itself."
This. In response to how battling can be more engaging to new players and old players alike...I mean, it really does need a total rehaul to make it simpler. I remember when I started on Subeta. I fought a battle and was surprised I didn't get any experience to level up. Then I gave up for years because I had no idea how icons work. And I still don't. All I know is more icons are better. I probably couldn't even name all the battle elements on Subeta, and I have no idea if any have strengths or weaknesses against each other. I have no idea if speed is really even useable as a stat and if it makes any difference. And there's dozens of other aspects I simply don't understand about battling. And I have a tier 12 pet. I just basically copy what the forums tell me to do.
At the very least, simplify icons and elemental symbols and all that to clear-cut numbers. "This weapon does 100 damage. This pet has 1000 HP. This modifier increases damage by 10%." At least then, middle school level math will explain what happens if both sides fought.
But if battling is to attract newer players, it really needs to be simpler, intuitive, and easy to understand just by dappling into it. That's how pretty much every system on Subeta works, after all.
I think of a small handful of weapons (the godlies) as being more similar to limited CWs than anything else. Just like people would be furious if an artist rereleased more of an expensive CW they were told was limited, people who spent 15bil+ on a weapon would be furious if we tanked the price to, I dunno, 2b. Not everyone who currently owns godlies earned them for free; some of them spent billions of SP and tons of CSC on their collections. I think when you're talking things worth literal billions of in-game currency that players have spent years collecting, you do have to be concerned about tanking the price.
We put a lot of thought into the 9b number, as well as the chance box release method. We looked at past sales, current availability, and the amount of SP and CSC that users have on hand/in their vaults (Keith helped us with all of this). We only want approximately five of each godly going out, so we couldn't put them on a challenger or as an achievement prize, as too many of each would get out there and they wouldn't maintain the 9b value. We couldn't drop five of each in the mil center, as everyone would only want the KWand and the Spork (the best and the newest godly, respectively). This method isn't perfect, but it facilitates trading and selling of extras, which was part of the goal (making godlies more obtainable without tanking the value).
I hope explaining our reasoning helps people understand where our heads were at, even if they don't like it!
Haha, maybe we solve this with some new Godlies that we can get through battle wars? :P
This is something a lot of people deal with in other parts of the site. I've spent a lot of money on plushies that later (just a matter of a couple of weeks sometimes) became almost worthless. It happens to everyone... except for weapons.
i've been on and off this site for 12 years now and it's honestly such a difficult thing to get into as a new user or get back into as an older user. CWs are already private and exclusive, battling is really obtuse and a lot of it is mindless clicking, and the forums are very quiet and it's hard to find people to interact with. i miss the days when events happened because i made new friends in the forums and battling wasn't so mindless because you had a purpose.
i don't think protecting the investments of some is the way to go; the community is already so small as it is that alienating more users will be certain death. give us a way to unite and interact to earn weapons and introduce new players to battling. can you tell i'm lonely??????
I am just going to put this out there. But I can see the argument from both sides.
On one hand, it is incredibly frustrating when you have spent a lot of money and time on your pets to win battle prizes - only for it to be lumped into a pricey box. I think earning through battle is seen to be fair because it is something that can be worked for by using battle pets as opposed to dumping cash into the site - like make people feel like all the hard work into training pets was for something. I can understand why some would feel insulted by it (especially spending years training pets). It obviously deters new battle players. Also, usually in the real world, the 1% get richer and richer so it may just happen that a bunch of weapons get lumped into a handful of accounts. So I understand it is an access and inclusivity issue. Like training a pet to cap TAKES SO MUCH TIME. I have a capped pet and I have sunken a lot of income into it.
On the other hand, God weapons were never designed to be for everyone. There are a lot of demi-god weapons that I own that do a borderline similar job with a strong pet - like you genuinely do not need a God weapon to win battles. It is really about if you want to spend more for a few extra icons and "the best". While I know it annoys and deters people, but those who have them often have spent years working towards them. For example, some old God weapons were in the Crystal shop back when fragging was a mission - you had to literally wait for items to restock (and yes shops used to sell out of rare+ itemsand you had to make an effort for rare items) and rare items would yield you like a crystal or two. I know for a fact that the OG Godly weapons have reached INSANELY HIGH prices. I know that people have been asking 15-30 bil from times and yea... some people pay it. So offering a 9bil cap is almost bringing the price down and regulating it (without offending the older players too much in case they did spend like 20bil buying it). It also gives players who don't battle a chance to buy.
I honestly do not know the correct solution here.
The link doesn't work (not that I can buy anything anyway lmao).
holy crap nine billion sp! i dont mind much tho and it sorta makes sense given that these are some of the oldest, most valuable items in the whole site. and honestly Subeta is pretty great at keeping old items in ciruclation, unlike, ahem, other sites, so I don't mind seeing stuff like this being insanely expensive
I've been on the site for nearly 14 years and even if I emptied out my entire wardrobe full of incredibly rare and high SP items, I still would not have enough SP to purchase that 9 billion SP loot box.
Look, Staff, we have been calling you guys out for years about how this site has gone so quickly into play-to-win. We've called out bad events that had flashing lights and minigames that were impossible for certain disabled players to complete where they got punished by receiving lower point counts than people who could complete those games. We've called out the way that Custom Wearable artists have been yanked around constantly. We've called out the arbitrary (and frankly racist and Eurocentric) rules against using foreign languages that get foreign players punished for not speaking English as well as those of us from countries where it's our native language. And what we get instead is money-grabs like this.
Like, by this point, a good portion of us are grown adults with daily jobs who are shoving a small portion of our paycheck at Subeta... do we really want to keep funding a circus run by people who don't listen to us, get rude with us or ban us when we call them out for bad business practices?
I'm an old user, but didn't get into battling right when I started. Instead it took me a few years until I took more interest.
The only thing I feel like I can do is just keep training my pet up, even though I'm pretty sure I hit the point where more stats will only help so much (Almost T12).
The only way for me to improve and be able to beat these harder opponents is to save insane amount of sP to buy weapons that can do the job. Even if I took the time and saved the years to get them, a lot of these great weapons aren't even in circulation anymore for people that do want to buy them.
There's a couple in the millionaire center, but we're talking about saving billions for 1 weapon.
I don't understand the reason why godlies should have their value protected so heavily. Same thing with other old weapons. The people who've owned those weapons for so long surely have gotten their money's worth (being able to be in the top percentage/exclusive prizes/etc), and the fact that nothing comes to rival them means that those users have no real reason to get new weapons or stimulate the economy by upgrading and selling their old weapons.
Like obviously you'd feel shafted if you spent a lot on a weapon and the price tanked (if you were planning on reselling at all?), but I just don't really see why we don't consider training up a pet and the prizes won from being able to beat hard opponents as "getting their money's worth."
Not sure if i'm making any sense at all. TLDR: People who got in on battling 10+ years ago and were able to access great items shouldn't be protected from the economy. They had years to continuously profit off of being in the top percent of battlers/getting exclusive prizes. No one can enter battling and actually rival them.
It feels like your only hope is to save billions, get 1 good weapon, and repeat. And this is assuming you spent the time + money to have a high stated pet in the first place.
I will never be rich enough to even buy the cheapest box on top of that I'm waiting for my quests to be reset guess I'm off to bed so I can get up in the morning, but I have seen a few good items others got n congratz to u
Yeah, the richest user has been broken for a while now. c': I'm like 73rd with less then 300m. lol
Also, I am the 18th richest user according to the system. I have just at 1 billion. Is that ranking wrong?
As said, making things accessible doesn’t mean handing them out as a Free Gift. I’ve been here 15 years, not a battler by any means, but have managed to train one pet up to Tier 11 in that time and spent, conservative estimate, over a billion just to get passable weapons. I don’t mind buying CSC to help me achieve goals, because I work 60 hours/week and can’t spend hours here. That’s always been the cool thing about Subeta to me…there’s always a way to get stuff if you work for it in whatever way is accessible to you…time investment, CSC investment, they can all lead to the same place. But battling has NEVER been like that. Because the CSC and time investment to get these is completely unobtainable for all but a handful of people. No one’s asking for handouts. We’re just saying, yo, Jeff Bezos, could we get some toilets in here?
It's good I don't care about battling I guess lollllll
as the 38th richest user... I ain't even got 1bil let alone 9. I wanted to try battling but it seems impossible to get into, glad to see I'm not crazy
I almost wonder if this is a decoy so they can take a bigger whack at reworking god prices. People don't like 9 bil, so say okay we hear you and will match to SoSS and Wrath (which until now people said were overpriced because Manifest and Natasha were close enough in use and much cheaper), and give the tiny amount of people who already bought a partial refund. Then be celebrated for finally breaking free of elite battlers'/1% hold on god weapon prices and acting on feedback from users. Prices are considered reasonable when they wouldn't have been thought so if originally released at that level, they get the god market prices where they really want them and they come out as heroes.
I think 2021 is messing with my mind lol.
In two weeks, I will have been on this site for 11 years. There has never been a reasonable way to get to battling. It was only for the oldest users when I got here and it has only gotten worse over the years. And while there have been re-releases of many items I've held onto over the years waiting for them to appreciate, just to go back to them being worthless, this has never been the case for battlers. It may not be admins who takes advantage of the system, but it for sure admins who insulate old friends from having their items lose value, or from having more challenges to their statuses. The only solution to any of the sites problems in putting caps on things. But a lot of things one could reasonable chase as achievements back in the day are now not even possible any longer, so I have to let those things go.
What I've learned on this site are a few lessons. Don't ever care too much about anything. The site doesn't, so I won't. Don't take anything personally. It's a business, and the site will try and make as much money as it can. This is capitalism. It is literally their jobs, so they have to make money. I don't love all the ways they go about it, but I wasn't asked. (I'd look into RL merch, for example, if I was asked). Subeta, like life, isn't fair. It's just a game. I hate things like this, but it's just a game. I just keep doing the things here I love to do and I'm not going to worry about. I will not ever be a battler on here, and I know that now. I just have to let that go. Maybe they will fix it someday; maybe they won't.
I do still love this place, but it has honestly felt very different in the past 2 or 3 years. It has lacked the storylines and exploration of characters that was happening before. Almost all discussions of characters now is in terms of battling, and often it just isn't worth the time, and it isn't storytelling. I'd love for the site to have more of the passion and life it once had, but if it is going the way of NP, I will just be here watching as it withers. Hopefully, this "event" is more than just the buying of useless items. We shall see.
the comments section is so validating right now. if staff are ever curious as to why old users quit and new users don't stay, this. this is why.
whoever has the time and resources to grind up to 9bil for a chance box probably needs to leave the house at some point
It's cute that anyone thinks wanting to be able to earn these things through battling (the way the few who already own them did) after investing years and years and millions, maybe billions, of sP to train and equip a worthy pet, is the same as asking for things to be "handed to us on a silver platter". Not to mention the chance lootbox aspect adds insult to injury. I don't think anyone is asking for anything to be free or easy here...
No one in the comments has realized the true purpose of all this... Hustler is gunnin' for Richest User.
Isn't that the point of trophies, which Subeta has a system for and can be made to retain their actual exclusivity while not also being a part of a battle system where they’re actively desired?
Wait. Nine Billions? I misread it as millions.
I cannot put into words how absolutely befuddled I am to read that admin is worried about "ruining" users' "investments."
This is a game.
Right?
Gatekeeping... Baffling.
Can't say I'm pleased, at all. Pretty pissed, actually.
9 billion, on a CHANCE box? Haha. No. Even if I could afford it, unless you get to pick your actual weapon, it's not worth it imo. That's hard earned SP, and a lot of it, for a chance!
The amount of salt is unreal.
As someone who has been restocking and saving for a year and a half and spent 25+ billion recently on a god, it disgusts me that people want things handed to them on a silver platter. 9 billion? Can't afford it? Save up and make it a goal.
Is this the best way to rerelease godlies? Maybe not. Maybe it should be in the crystal shop of 1m crystals, or the battle shop for 5k impossible tokens.. Regardless, people will complain.
Wo the news post just had me like "this is suspiciously vague" and then I look at the comments and it's way too much to read, I just have the "What the heck happened here" meme picture in mind looking at this. xP
I rarely comment and I definitely don't battle but c'mon, y'all knew this was ridiculous.
Seems like “protecting value” was an argument for requiring all pet names to be unique. A few people would cry every so often about how they’d quit if other people were allowed to have the names they’d refreshed rapidly to get at clearing time. But it turned out to be pretty great to make names more accessible. Be cool if battling had a similar mindset change. Even a teeny bit. Because who’s got 9b to spend on a random chance at a weapon? Someone who probably already has it.
Seems like “protecting value” was an argument for requiring all pet names to be unique. A few people would cry every so often about how they’d quit if other people were allowed to have the names they’d refreshed rapidly to get at clearing time. But it turned out to be pretty great to make names more accessible. Be cool if battling had a similar mindset change. Even a teeny bit. Because who’s got 9b to spend on a random chance at a weapon? Someone who probably already has it.
I mean, the whales would probably be happy if we didn't devalue their godlies at all, haha. I have seen verified screenshots of godlies selling for 14-16 bil+ (often with an additional 100k+ CSC added to that) in the past few years, which is ridiculous. From the very start, godlies have been "worth" about 10b (adjusted to current SP value). This is just our attempt to bring them back down to (just under) their real value and get more into the game so they can actually start changing hands again. They're not something people need to have to progress, at all; this is just for people who want them. Think of them as the equivalent of special old Neopets plot prizes or Flight Rising Kickstarter items; they're meant to be a status symbol. The other box is meant for everyone; it's a very reasonable price (its contents were all UB) and it'll be going out for "free" as an event prize, too, for the people who can't or won't spend 125m.
Loot boxes. Fucking loot boxes? Jesus, Subeta, just when I think you can't possibly get any lower, you pass the basement and start digging into the frigging earth.
Also, new.subeta.net sucks, is laggy, confusing, buggy, and I HATE IT. When the rest of the site is brought over to new.subeta I'm peacing out like Solsticesprite.
Also is this literally a situation of not pissing off some whales who are dumping thousands of USD a month into the economy?
Can we offset that by making a CSC donation pool where if we hit X CSC donated we can get old items rereleased in a normal way?
Pwease :3c
Suggestion on how to do event-specific items in order to make battling suck less and be more enticing for people of all tiers, while also making it less prone to people gaming the system by hypertraining low level pets and stocking em up with scrolls ala “Top in Tier X” setup:
-For plot challengers, find out the tier of a user’s highest tier pet when the event starts, or when the event ends, whichever is higher (Maybe calculate for discrepancies of plus a tier or two so you don’t discourage people who are training through the event). This is a user’s “highest tier”. -Figure out how much damage is a reasonable amount of damage for a pet of EACH TIER over X amount of time that you consider “worthy” of earning that plot-specific weapon (e.g. it would take approximately 6 hours of straight clicking to deal X amount of damage for pet of Tier Y). Increase the time for lower tiers, but still make it a reasonable grind (e.g. a Tier 3 pet may take 10 total hours of grinding over the course of a weekend event, which sucks but is still doable). -Announce this system, and announce the grand prize cutoff for each “highest tier” before the event starts, and potentially give people notice that a battle weekend is coming up so people can actively try and plan around it.
Also: -Put old weapons in the millionaire shop for not 9b and not at random.
lol that must be someone else's brain dropping a few zeros and trying to buy something I can't even come close to affording, not my brain nope not at all
It took me close to 45 min to read every comment posted here. Im bored now. I dont have 9B, but if I did I also wouldnt pay that amount for a chance box. As for the 125Mil one. If Im too lazy to click my way over to the MC to buy a Natasha. What makes you think Ill go click my way over to this dude for a random T10 item? From what Ive seen in this they have all been T10 weapons.
Yes! You put this very well. Imagine how much could have been done if they’d spent as much time brainstorming making battling as a whole accessible to the broader group as they did on figuring out how to uphold the investment of a few.