IMPORTANT: THIS IS ABSOLUTELY, IN NO WAY MEANT TO COME ACROSS AS UNGRATEFUL FOR THE WORK BEING PUT INTO THE MAINTENANCE. simply the post-maintenance presentation of gifts that seem to indicate the staff is saying things are fixed or done with, so let's have a party to celebrate! (i really don't know how to fix and phrase that better, I'm sorry. I'll exit if i think of something better.)

Like don't get me wrong, I really appreciate these GA and quest bonuses, but could they have waited until the site was actually usable? the lag is insane even now, and has been the past few days since the site came back. this in no way is meant as an attack at the site or staff, i greatly appreciate the work that has gone into this entire thing. it's just, couldn't the "thanks for waiting for us to be done fixing things" have waited until those things had been fixed? it just, i dunno. seems like such a waste.

application errors, massive lag, lots of other things other people have been posting, i dunno. again, i understand just how much y'all are working here, it's just the way these are being presented makes it sound as if everything is all fine and dandy now, when it very obviously isn't.

edit: and just to prove my point, got an application error trying to post this and had to retype it all over again. sigh... edit 2: now a bad gateway 502! glad i copied all the text this time... edit 3: apparently one or the other actually went through, after 3 posts were made on this thread and now there's a duplicate. dang it Dx

I get what you are saying . It is frustrating.

I mean almost all the comments on the weekend quest news were all saying the same thing, and it felt there needed to be a thread to voice that? Keith posted line 4 hours ago only to say they're working on lag, which is great, but not much has really changed and quests like the wizard that are time based are... not good for lag. and maleria seems to be broken too?

Yes, obviously we'd like there to not be lag and we're working on it.

278 users online and I got the heroku error while taking a pet out of training. Whoops. :P The bonus quest rewards were likely pushed now to help stress-test things, which is okay. I get the user frustration, but if it means that it'll help the site wheeze less during click-heavy holidays, I am okay with this.

I'm personally a bit more grated that this bonus was dropped at like... 2am for me (gmt+1). I do get why (work and timezones) but it feels bad, man. "Europe? What's that? Sounds fake but ok."

Two out of three bonus days is still really good and I do appreciate the reward, don't get me wrong. I'm just a bit grumpy about the timing.

I was just coming to make a feedback thread for this very thing.

I really do appreciate the progress staff is trying to make, and the effort they've put into everything. I imagine that they're just (if not more) frustrated than we are because I doubt they want to still be dealing with this x amount of days after the maintenance.

The compensation / gifts are also 10/10. I appreciate the GA time, and the bonuses to quests are also really great too. And I say this because in no way am I saying that these things aren't enough. They are.

The problem is that right now, only the people with the patience to deal with the obscene lag get to have these rewards.

We got out GA time extended, but I haven't been able to do my quests a single day since we got it. I've maybe done Shinwa ONE day, but couldn't stomach continuing after that alone took 10 minutes for 5 quests.

Today I woke up, with only 250 users online thinking I could get my quests in super early before work and the lag shouldn't be bad with so few users onsite but boy was I wrong. 30 minutes just to do Shinwa, Blue, and my Battles. And boy was I frustrated as hell the entire time I was doing them.

Anyways TLDR; The rewards are amazing. I appreciate staff a ton. In the future please give out rewards when the site is stable again, so everyone can get the rewards you're giving out, not just people with extra time / patience to smash their face into the lag otherwise what's the point of it being there to show your appreciation with ALL of us.

This is honestly ridiculous. I've never seen a site that is more business than not have such problems. You can't talk about thinking of selling it or just leaving most of the work to the other staff, not stay immersed in the technology field so that you understand the importance of testing and resolving errors that may occur, and expect for anything more than this. Just under a week later and there are still plenty of problems.

Each time there have been significant changes, it's been troublesome, to say the least. This is by far the worst, but earlier is when I decided to spend a whole lot less on here... like hundreds less. While Fireside is not as major as Lumi, you still have 2 significant events coming up and while I'm sure the stress is real, this is as unprepared as it gets.

I pay for a higher internet speed at my house for a few reasons so when this site is laggy AF, including the error pages, I have absolutely no patience for it and would much rather spend my time elsewhere.

There's plenty that are grateful for the GA - especially those that didn't have one before - but I pay for one monthly and when I can't use it's best feature for fear of it messing up (autopricer), then extra days to me just aren't worth it all that much. The questing takes absurdly long also, which makes me not even have enough to put in to my shop to take that chance, either. (enough patience or items)

These are my thoughts and opinions which I generally don't express on here due to the offensiveness level being where it is, but overall, this is a business and wouldn't be able to survive w/out those that contribute to the site.

Come on, be fair.

It's no different than my saying I can't quest for literal hours on end because I'm an adult and have other responsibilities. That also applies to coders having lives outside of Subeta.

Be fair. We're all frustrated, no doubt of it, and sniping at each other isn't going to help.

This is a really weird complaint. The staff have repeatedly said they're working on the problem. Subeta's a big site and they seem to have a small staff, so things probably take a while to get done because there's only 24 hours in a day. I was following the official twitter the other day and I was impressed by how transparent they were being about what was going on and what they were working on at a given time... and it went on for hours longer than they expected and they still worked on it. I don't think they're being neglectful.

As to the quests, I agree that lag makes them more annoying to do but like others have pointed out, they probably did this as a stress test too to see how well the site does when activity is intense. It's better to do that now and address it than have this happen during bigger events, so I don't see how they're "unprepared" if they're trying to prepare ahead.

Whenever I'm tired of dealing with lag when doing the quests I just go do something else. Nobody's forcing you to do all the quests today, you can always do them without the bonuses when things calm down.

Considering that it took longer than expected (by the userbase, I'm sure Keith and Bug knew to factor in more time), you could either wait 2 weeks until it's all straightened out OR take what gifts you can and go.

Sometimes, you just have to go. They're working on it.

The issue here isn't the lag itself or other technical issues — everyone seems very understanding about that. The issue is that giving out gifts during a time period that makes them basically unusable makes everything MORE frustrating, not less. Being given a GA and bonus quests right now just emphasizes how no one is able to use them.

The quests, at least, I get. It's nice that anyone willing to go through the trouble of attempting them gets better rewards to compensate for all the quests they probably can't complete. But the GAs should have waited and/or been given out as an item so users could choose when to use them. It's such a simple solution.

It's not unreasonable for there to be overwhelming feedback to this effect, because this is not the first time this has been an issue. This has happened before with basically the same feedback and if the staff didn't listen, then of course people are going to try to be louder in hopes that maybe they'll finally be heard.

Probably because this site has come a long ways from what it used to be like, and then lately it's been going down the shitter again with old problems like lag that should have been fixed years ago, or at least by now. It's unacceptable. Couple years back, we could have an average of 600+ players on at the same time without hiccups. Now we're lucky if the site doesn't lag at that number. Add on that nothing else to engage the player content-wise (questing gets old, and is easily the most boring thing on this site), and doesn't solely revolve around the stupid dress-up aspect, people are gonna leave. If this place had something to the equivalent of Neopet's old Habitarium, I'd easily waste more time here cause that game was addicting and fun (RIP Habi). Minion Zoo is just another lame collection thing.

If by the "stupid dress up aspect" you mean the most popular part of the site, sure.

Not really sure what you're talking about here. I've explicitly said I'm not thinking about the site, because the only thing of value on this site is the 15 years of data that we have on all of the users. It'd be sold, everyone on the team would be let go, and whoever bought it would run it for another year before letting it shut down. I'm not sure where you've seen me say a single thing about being interested in running it.

Secondly, I am immersed in the technology field. Subeta is not my day job. Since it not being my day job I've been the lead engineer on healthcare.gov pushing code to 45 million users, and I'm now the lead engineer at Glitch. As Subeta declines in users and income, this has happened to most of the staff. This is a hobby to a lot of us now (I for example haven't been paid by Subeta in two years). I don't really know how to explain beyond that.

So like, the solutions here aren't great. I get to spend a lot of free time on a site that I love with a userbase that I have great respect and motivation for, and try to make sure that it at least has the solid foundation to stick around for another few years. The rewrites that happened over the last week rip out 10 year old code from the foundations of Subeta, and the work that was pushed out last night moves us to a more modern caching stack.

The way that Subeta works just isn't how websites are supposed to work anymore, so with every update to PHP or MySQL older pieces of the site crumble and require attention. We can't avoid those updates and just stay on old versions because they also come with important security updates so that we can protect your data. A complete rewrite would cost $50,000 (or more) which is something that we just don't have the ability to pull together anymore, unfortunately.

I had no idea you worked on Glitch! That's awesome. (Sorry for the off-topic.)

Yeah, and it gets old since that's the only thing you've given as a profitable option to your playerbase. Not everyone gives a damn about CWs and the drama world it entails. I'm saying offer other options to hit more than just the wearables crowd.

Hundreds of suggestions are always given, and yet you won't even try them. It's not our fault, the userbase, you haven't paid yourself in two years. You don't give your consumers a reason to give money to this place.

Hehe yup, I've been there for about a year now, leading the community effort! It's been really great, and feels a lot like Subeta in terms of building a great community of compassionate & cool people ????

I should look into the community side of it more! I usually just browse around to look at all the cool projects, but it's good to know the community is nice. I'm always a bit intimidated by online communities. :P

Being told that you don't give a crap anymore, and that the only thing of value about Subeta is our userdata is hard to hear. Just, damn.

Does anyone remember 10 years ago, the 100k users celebration? That was the time to rewrite everything, buy new servers, hire more coders, etc. Users were begging Keith to make a Kickstarter or start a fund we could donate to to improve the site. But we were told just to buy stuff from the Cash Shop and not worry about it. Now we have less than 1,000 users and things are falling down around our ears. Any you know what? It isn't the users' fault.

I'm not really sure how to articulate my frustration. I've been with Subeta for 15 years and we've always had lag and so on. It should be a meme at this point.

and now people are talking about selling the site and Keith is saying the only thing he sees of value here anymore is userdata?

I was just trying to give a voice to the MANY comments ive seen (notably from the quest announcement though) that hadn't been acknowledged at all. then immediately get steamrolled by people putting words in my mouth I explicitly said the opposite of, and a dismissive non-reply from Keith that doesn't seem like he even looked at my text at all.

It's exactly what Sekhmet above is saying. Like, thanks for being honest you don't care anymore at least, I guess... :/

No where in Keith's comment did I see/read that he doesn't care about this site. In fact, it's still running because he cares! He said he's not thinking about selling it because in selling it he would only get the value for the data and they'd shut down the site in no time! Honestly a small site like this wouldn't be worth keeping up and running unless it was a labor of love - something a company wouldn't do.

It really feels like there's no pleasing everyone. I'm sorry that people are hitting so many issues with questing and such but I'm only having a few small problems here and there. I'm thankful for the extra effort and the extra goodies from staff. They didn't have to do that.

As far as the site being laggy and such... All servers go through issues. All games go through issues. I couldn't play a major game for days at the beginning of the month because it kept erroring and I wasn't the only one.

TL;DR Everyone's complaining but I'm thankful the staff is working on things and being transparent about it. If the lag is hitting you that hard then I'm sorry but it should be better tomorrow and even better the day after that since staff is working their asses off to fix it for us!