Thank you! Reading 's experiences about being a new-ish user really got me thinking about how hard it is to start out here. Though TBH, just in the last few months I've encountered long-time users who 1) didn't know about the CW cash shops worked, 2) didn't know how to use scode on the forums, 3) didn't know about or how to redeem wigs in the salon, 4) didn't know about buying CSC/subscriptions (which seems like a BIG fault on subeta's part - they need money!!), 5) didn't know where to find admin posts, etc etc. Subeta is just really lacking on easily accessible information the more I think about it!

Honestly, yeah! I'd love the feature in general, especially for new or even returning users (inactive for x period of time, it gets flagged to have a "Hey welcome back!" message). I suppose most older users could just make help boards, but really as a person with anxiety it takes me a long time until I'm finally brazen enough to just kick a door in and ramble in the open; so I could definitely see a feature like this helpful for anyone, new or old.

My only issue with the verbiage being added for the original name is it's a slap in the face to anyone who went inactive and had their pet name taken. Because technically speaking, they had the original.

I know personally, in the fictitious AU where I left not knowing at 1 year my account would be inactive (since obviously I know the score here), I'd be livid to find not only my names gone BUT the person who created them also has a cute little star or verbiage saying "I'm the first of my name". Since we're kinda talking "let's not let the site die, let's get more people playing" this is something that should be considered (by staff).

I don't mind one way or another, if this happens. I don't know if there's even something in place to flag pets with taken names in mass, or if staff would even plan to handle those names or not, but this would be my only "ehh" about the idea.

... which is unrelated (welcome to adhd) but when and if this actually happens I hope staff remember to remove pet names from clearing when accounts go inactive. Just because it wouldn't be relevant anymore and no need to give free renames/your name was taken messages when non-unique names are a thing.

I'm not getting the pings to this thread, ugh broken stuff =[

That is something worth considering. Although I kind of feel like if someone's gone long enough to be inactive and have their names taken, they've really forfeited any and all rights to those names, "original" status included. Also, not sure how many people actually return after such a long absence and then decide to care enough about the site that it matters, but I do know it happens. So, good point.

Anyway, they may not have "Steve" anymore, but at least they'll always have "Steve_318 ⭐" if they don't rename haha.

I love the idea of a mentor system, though I wonder how involved it would have to be. Like, would mentors be expected to be online more frequently/consistently if a newbie is their mentee? I think a ticket system that doles out newbie questions to volunteer user mentors might be a little more appropriate, since people could answer questions/give help on their own time, as needed.

If it were a ticket-like system that went to users instead of UAs, there are bound to be a few instances where newbies ask questions about a bug or site error, or anything that should be reported to a UA. In these cases, user mentors should be able to forward the ticket to a UA.

If such a feature existed, there should be some sort of vetting process--e.g. be on the site for 2+ years, be relatively active (log in at least a handful of times a week, have so many posts/achievements/pets/idk, any measure that shows how active a user is), etc. Maybe mentor/senior users could be given a little star next to their username (or some other indicator) to show that they're willing to help newbies out, which shows up in the forums, news comments, etc. Sort of like a community seniority thing--it represents a responsibility/willingness to help out.

Ok, I have read enough and no one has said what CW stands for. Anyone wants to shed some light on it? lol

Custom Wearables created by players.

Thank you very much! ♥

You're welcome :)

A buddy system thing would be great (And I remember it being recommended ages ago on a Suggestions thread)

Only issue is if people sign up, please, Oldbies, actually get on the site and do something.

It's hard to play this game when you want to trade for an item and no one ever responds despite being on and posting to other boards. Life gets in the way, but if you're invested enough to be in the CW market or sign up, be present. It's not good form if we sign up to help people and ghost with no explanation!

A mentor system would be fantastic, especially if you also happen to be the one that brings them in via the referral system. Perhaps participating in the buddy system as a mentor, you can get referral points? Incentivize players to participate.

Also, I'm all for a non-unique name system. It wouldn't be an issue to keep it if pet slots had been capped at a much smaller number, but that's a foregone conclusion. Besides, it'd give us an edge over Neopets in that sense, even more than before. Even before the amount of pet slots became an issue, hunting or tracking a specific name was never fun. I spent years trying to get Talia's name. It went through multiple people, and I got lucky that the name cleared or changed hands and gave me a chance at it each time. No one should have to go through that ordeal. And for anyone who was with me in tracking down the name have hit the end of the line because it's a name I'm not ever letting go. But other people should be allowed to have the name as well, the more pets named Talia out there, the merrier!

i guess i'm in the minority that finds this....incredibly disappointing

80% of my ideas are from having to be creative with the names I have and I'm really proud of some of the names I've managed to get. idk I guess being able to name them whatever I want makes them feel disposable. Just web pages. I have 0 interest in battling and food/books aren't really of any value since I'm not a completionist. If I can have any name at any point to make any character I want, I might as well make a tumblr or something that has more intuitive tools for page design and 100% less lag

pets as a creative outlet were kind of my last stake here and I doubt I'll be around after/if that change is made.... but at the rate anything happens here I'm sure that's a few years down the line 👀

i'm actually in agreement with frenchi on this. i have a decent amount of pets and sometimes i had to make little work-arounds for ideas i had. i think instead of just completely doing away with unique names, why not have an option for nicknames? that way the people who enjoy unique names don't get shafted, and those who want names that are already taken still get to have the name they want and have it displayed.

The primary reason for all of this is to make Subeta more accessible to everyone, and to hopefully draw more income to the site. A nickname system does nothing that a few notes on a profile cannot essentially do already, and if anything it would make things even more confusing to new users.

A new person joining the site HAS to make a pet to do anything. Imagine joining a site and spending 45min trying every word and name, and every desirable variation of that, just to find everything unavailable (as was the experience expressed here). It isn't welcoming. Adding some kind of note to the creation page like "name your pet whatever is available but you can give it a better nickname later!" is SO convoluted.

A nickname workaround also doesn't help the site financially. The number of users who have already expressed willingness to spend money if the name system is changed speaks for itself, I think. People will want slots, money to buy potions and TC items, custom overlays, etc.

i guess i'm in the minority that finds this....incredibly disappointing

80% of my ideas are from having to be creative with the names I have and I'm really proud of some of the names I've managed to get. idk I guess being able to name them whatever I want makes them feel disposable. Just web pages. I have 0 interest in battling and food/books aren't really of any value since I'm not a completionist. If I can have any name at any point to make any character I want, I might as well make a tumblr or something that has more intuitive tools for page design and 100% less lag

pets as a creative outlet were kind of my last stake here and I doubt I'll be around after/if that change is made.... but at the rate anything happens here I'm sure that's a few years down the line 👀

even if unique pet names are done away with, there's nothing stopping you from using that same creativity with name workarounds. You can keep your pets named the way they are if you like them that way, and if you're proud of what you've done for them.

I used to be firmly in the 'no non-unique pet names' camp, but after thinking about it I really feel like there's no good reason not to do away with them. It's a relic of a bygone era. I had a lot of fun and pride in the past getting up early and refreshing pages trying to get the pet names I want, but at this point that part of the game isn't really fun at all. I truly don't see how giving users more options to be creative with their pets is taking away from the pet experience.

For me personally my reluctance came down to the fact that I saw my pet names as a status symbol, but, like... what kind of status, really lol. It's not like it took any real effort to get those names, and it's not like they have much value. You can't sell or trade pets on Subeta. Plus let's be real, they just sit on my account. It's not like I'm especially active. I think I'd be more inclined to actually play and work on my pets if I could successfully migrate all my OCs over here.

That being said I'm also 100% in favour of nicknames, or a 'legacy' status. But mostly I'm curious to see what the ratio is of people who want non-unique pet names and people who don't. I think a poll would be best practice before any changes are made; that would help determine whether or not something like a nickname system or legacy status should be added or not.

honestly the way i see switching to non-unique names is that it's not so much 'oh man what i worked hard to get is now easy to get for everyone' but more of a 'nice now i can have more things i want'

ages ago i worked rly hard on visiting melody every day bc essence of melody were expensive af and i rly wanted a nostalgic pet, but now that they're cheap i don't feel like it devalues my nostlagic pet, you feel? i'm just happy that if i want another one i don't have to work as hard for it

and like for me something i rly don't like about unique names is that it creates this sort of... culture? kinda? where like some people are more "deserving" of desirable names and that just always rubbed me the wrong way ;; someone who spends hundreds of dollars on profiles/art/stories isn't more deserving of a real name than someone who just wants it bc it's the name of their cat and owning it makes them happy

also agree with clearings stopped being fun years ago lmao i'm so sick of having to set phone reminders and stalking accounts and hoping ppl forget to log in (which in itself is a shitty thing to hope for but i know i'm not the only one who does this)

and as far as a legacy marker or something like that goes i think it's a good idea!! i'd like it to be its own css class so i can easily remove it tho

Big Controversial Opinion Time re: pet names

Keep in mind this is entirely my opinion and I'm basing this solely on the things ive read posted by staff regarding the sites status. I don't think, if this site is going to survive, subeta can rely solely on the opinion of the older userbase. This isnt a debate about us and who is getting screwed over because they can or can't have Karen as a name. SUBETA is getting screwed because people aren't giving money, old users are leaving and new users aren't staying around long enough to be any sort of income for the site.

People who yell "this isn't toyhouse, go there", uh. yeah. people ARE and thats a big problem. Why are you so opposed to this change that you would rather see people leave the site and no longer support it? This is something that can bring in new users, income from both new & old users, and very potentially be part of this site's survival. Like, does your status symbol that you were either around long enough to make a name or happened to autorefresh to death at 3pm really mean more to you than the site's survival? Nobody's getting their status symbol names if the site dies from lack of user retention & financial instability. /SHRUG EMOJI

Also yes I'm completely aware that names aren't the only solution to the site's problems but 's post covered that well enough. It's 3am and I'm still tired so this might be worded weirdly or come off antagonistic but I'm genuinely curious like. no fight me just converse.

I guess I'm jumping in a little late here, but I've been playing Subeta for almost 14 years and I have played a LOT of other petsites too, as well as mobile and console gaming, and I have plenty of thoughts... sooo I can't help myself woop here we go!!

one: I absolutely see why people would be upset about changing unique names, I have a couple I'm proud of snagging myself. However, I think that's one thing that will unfortunately just have to go. One thing that immediately turns me off of signing up for ANY new thing, game or otherwise, is the struggle of picking a name that isn't already in use. It's infuriating to me and I have absolutely declined to participate in something when I went through 10, 15, 20 names and all of them were taken and I finally just said "fine, f*ck this!" and gave up. For the pets on petsites to be inherently competitive just seems silly to me. They are your pets. That should be the easiest part of the site to navigate, first and foremost.

I have almost 200 dragons on Flight Rising and it doesn't bother me at all that other people share some of those names with theirs. In fact, I do searches sometimes to see what the other ones look like and it's kinda fun. But I would not go through that "this name? NOPE. how about- NOPE. maybe- REALLY??" for... uhh any more pets tbh. it's hard enough to come up with 200 freaking names to begin with (thank goodness for the random name generator).

so i agree that I actually would be inclined to spend more money on pet slots if we were able to have any pet with any name. that would make it possible for a lot of us to get more of our dream pets without having to barter and trade with other users.

second: updated tutorial 100%, I loved 's idea of rewards for the tutorial steps. maybe even just integrate it into achievements? whether we do mentors or not, I think this is essential. There are SOOO MANY tiny moving parts to Subeta, so many dailies, so many different things you can do and places you can go, it's impossible to even know what to DO when you first come on. I still don't even know what to do with myself half the time lmao??

I don't know if I can envision mentors being an 'official' site thing though. we had an unofficial mentor program in my flight on FR for a while and we actually shut it down because new users were so shy about approaching us, we just didn't have enough people signing up for it to sustain it. People are already so scared to come to the forums here (myself included, and I been here already rofl), I don't think newbies would go for that feature as much as oldbies would go for it.

third: my biggest observation, which I swear hurts me to say as much as it hurts to read... Subeta still looks and feels old, and I think it comes down to, essentially, an issue of branding. I've loved every minute of my time on Subeta, but it feels outdated when you look at it. The layout is clunky, the gameplay is simple, it's a bit of a relic for a nostalgic time. While I personally still love that, I can see why it would be a turnoff to today's gamers who have stuff like Animal Crossing on their phones. I think our strongest areas in terms of art are, ofc, wearables (obviously CWs and cash shop wearables being top tier there), and a lot of the new food and drink items we have are just gorgeous for how small they are. but even those as categories lack consistency when you look at some of the really old stuff on here.

I just think the only way Subeta could really make a big impression on future gamers would be a biiiig a facelift. and that includes - please don't impale me - the art. mainly I'm talking non-wearable items, pets, maps. I'm not saying the art is bad or that i dislike it in any way. again, this hurts to say because I obviously am fond of the art or I wouldn't have been here for over a decade. but the art is often inconsistent. the look and feel of this website has never really been what I would call cohesive or polished. we do a lot of revamps (and that's awesome and fun!!) but like, needing revamps is a problem. you can see several eras of art styles and revamps and changes in just your own shop, just from junk that accumulates in your inventory. the only stuff that feels consistent and 'on-brand' are the cash shop lines of wearables. even take people's avatars and items that are wearable. someone who buys CWs exclusively, their avatars look like they're from a completely different site than someone wearing a Goffick Jacket and base eyes/hair!

think about what makes other games iconic; literally the icons that make up the site, how it looks. That good ole yellow sidebar. To this day if I see an omelette I get flashbacks to Neo. Look at any dragon or familiar, hell, any item from Flight Rising, you know it's from FR. I know a Goatlings goat on-sight regardless of what appearance doll it's wearing. Subeta just has too much for all of it to always make you think "Oh, subeta!" when you see it out of context.

I almost feel like at this point, with all the different piece-parts and all the different changes we are always calling for, it would maybe make the most sense to - again please don't impale me i'm just gonna say it - do a big kickstarter and overhaul the whole entire thing. make a subeta 2.0, start almost from scratch, so that everything can kind of be rebooted. Which yeah that's ADMITTEDLY a terrible and much more daunting idea. I am not saying we SHOULD do that, ever, or that it's in any way feasible. I'm speaking purely idealistically here. (for those that don't know, FR and Dappervolk were both kickstarter funded and FR has been doing swell for years now.)

Think about games like Animal Crossing and beloved they are because of how it looks, because of how cute the characters are, because of the way it feels when you play it, because they are iconic. We loved our Neopets because they were so cute in all those different colors (UC plushie zafara will always be the lost love of my life, RIP in peace) and they were both so deeply coveted and memorable, in large part, because for many of us the art is both how and why we primarily interact with the game.

Originally when I signed up for Subeta it was like, the less moderated, edgier version of neopets lol (like the NSFW items have been mentioned aplenty, and this was before many of the social policy changes we've had). That was the main appeal for me then. I still wanted neopets for my pets, but I wanted the social aspects (including HAs) & expanded worldbuilding that subeta had to offer; there were items and pets here I wanted to collect that never would have been allowed on more 'kiddie' sites.

the expansive lore, the events we get, the funny/nsfw/reference items, and generally just the sheer amount of items you can collect are some of Subeta's biggest & longest lasting strengths. But it's hard to get people to see those aspects if it doesn't look appealing on the surface. I know that sucks to say but with games it's 100% true.

Subeta, for all of it's charm, for everything I love about it, for all of the blood, sweat and tears that have been poured into it by users and staff alike (including myself)... I just feel like it has always kind of lacked that. And if Im being completely honest I have always felt that way. That combined with the coding/layout issue just makes it... kinda visually unappealing right from the get-go. I HAVE to use custom CSS, I can't stand the basic layout/s. I wouldn't even refer someone now without telling them you can use custom CSS. It's an amazing feature (especially for accessibility implications!) but needing custom CSS to make the site visually palatable to me, as someone who is already a devoted fan, is a problem. Plus I can't imagine it makes things any cleaner or lighter on the server end.

Again, Subeta has always been a labor of love (another of it's strengths), and honestly, has always felt more collaborative between the users and staff than any other game I've played. I think this is what has contributed to it's, sort of, almost patchwork feeling to it. In some ways that's very nice and almost quaint, but I do think it's had a detrimental effect on new signups. games in general, and the rest of the internet, have evolved over time in ways Subeta has not. petsites were innovative in the 2000s when the most you could do outside of one was, like, join a webring lol. Neopets (and Subeta, give credit where it's due!) taught us to CODE! it inspired a whole generation of codesmiths! that sh*t was WILD back in the day! But the rest of the internet caught up and surpassed that type of thing, and now it feels... lacking in some way, despite the ample features and items.

That issue of branding has become everything both to other games and just to websites. I don't think I've ever really seen Subeta take that on as a concept.

It's always tweaking little things, revamps and do-overs, existing site features or behind-the-scenes debugging to, ostensibly, make room for yet more new features. but that stuff only appeals to existing players, and that only does so much for player retention- probably nothing much at all for new signups. More and more and more is not what Subeta needs right now. Frankly I think we need less clutter overall.

All that said, I don't know if Subeta can rise to those ranks. Branding has never been the most important thing because that's not what Subeta is. It's not a brand, it's not owned by a company, it's not about selling stuff. It just is what it is. And what it is, is an incredibly complex work that has taken over a decade to become the community that it is now. I don't know if there's anything else left on the internet quite like Subeta, and I don't know - if we made some of these big changes and tried to appeal to new players - if the end result we'd get would still exactly be Subeta, you know what I mean? And like, idk maybe that would be a good thing, maybe it's time. Or maybe it would be terrible and we'd all revolt and leave. Who effing knows, lol. These are just my observations.

Regardless of what happens in the future I will continue to play Subeta and I hope it lives forever. I hope we never come on and see a goodbye message. But attracting new players will be a big part of that, and new players are going to make snap judgements based on things like the home page/the layout, the way the art looks, etc. That comes long before anyone gets into (or freaked out by) stuff like CWs, the forums/community, etc. Think about how we use the internet. Swiping left on other people. Even Stumbleupon is too cumbersome for most of us these days. We need a constant feed of new entertainment scrolling past us at all times. We like bright colors and flashy graphics and for things to be easy to find. Not only is it really hard to find stuff on subeta (not, like, stuff stuff, but like, information, places, etc) but there is just so much of it.

I think that could be a draw for new people still, but on the surface, sh*t's gonna have to start looking more like candy or we won't get people who are invested enough in tackling the learning curve to get that sweet, sweet loot. (again, not saying the art is bad, we have millions of gorgeous, lovingly drawn items on this website. but even amongst the most coveted items, many of those things would look like they're from totally different games if compared out of context.)

Fourth I take a lot of hiatuses and I know I'm not the only longtimer who does (its not personal, I can't do anything every single day for 13 years) and I desperately need a newsletter oh my god please I VOLUNTEER!!!!!!! even if other ppl just wanna like get together in a thread or a discord server even and unofficially put it together ourselves, can we do that, please??? I miss so much even if I skip out for just a couple of months. We need something other than individual news page posts, and separate ping groups, and twitter, and aaah there's too much, we need one place to put less-frequent but bigger updates.

ok sorry for the novel everyone my meds are kicking in so ill shut up now. if you read all that im so sorry kisses ur forehead

While I won't be happy about non-unique names, I'm not going to fight for it to death (if it happens, happens, if the site dies then it dies, I have other hobbies), so this is just my view on why people won't be happy: a lot of people like being unique. Or having something unique. The site caters to that pretty well with pet names, top tier battle weapons, hard achievements or lastly nearly impossible to get CWs. Everyone can get something but not all of it. Try suggesting making all CWs in unlimited copies for 700csc each (that would make people buy csc, isn't it?) or distributing unlimited weapons and you'll get some inevitable backlash too. Why stop on non unique names, let's add some crazy amounts of sP or csc for everyone so that we can get expensive wearables, books, and foods, let's spotlight all the pets, etc. etc. It'll be super easy and welcoming then. Just, what's the point in making any effort then?

@/serinde

i think with pet names it's different because it doesn't feel like an achievement to have a name you want. if you want an angelic pet, you quest and save up for a potion! same with achievements or weapons, those are all things you can work towards but if someone has the name you want then, well, you can't really do anything about it ;;

like i don't think you're wrong or anything!! i def get where you're coming from haha i just dunno, i feel like names shouldn't be some rare coveted thing because they're........ literally just names

(not gonna mention cw's because tbh that's a different discussion altogether i think and also not one i really care about if i'm being honest asdfghjkl)

[edit]

also thinking about it more, one of the things i really like about subeta is that nothing is permanently retired and goals are achievable, which to me was a huge selling point over neopets (i mean that and being able to say fuck lmao)

so basically... why do anything ever if someone else will be able to get it? achievements, battle weapons, wearables, sp, csc... all those are things you can work toward and obtain in time. subeta doesn't make these things limited anyway >gestures at the crystal shop, antique shop, etc. things like weapons and limited official items are inevitably rereleased on this site for others to get. staff has said so themselves in the past and i don't see a massive backlash every time that happens. or if there is, it settles down rather quickly.

and like said.... names are just names. there's nothing special about it & it gives you absolutely 0 advantage anywhere i'm sorry but this comparison of "let's just give everyone a million dollars to get everything they want" is... really grasping at straws lol items are things you can work towards & save up for; even rare weapons get sold. pet names you cannot because once one person has it nobody else can.

(also yea go for it make all CWs unlimited at 700 csc i don't care lmao. that's not a market i really care about so i'm not gonna bother seriously touching on it)