I thought it woudl be interesting to create a list of weapons that seem like they should be better (based on price/rarity/tier) than they are and how to fix them. If some of these get implimented or if people think its interesting i'll try to add to the list.

Starting off with: Former CS Legendary, now in the MC. Was made scaling and a tier 1 weapon and had 2 mod slots removed when people complained about the tier system and not being able to use their cash shop weapons on their low tier pets. It is now not in the cash shop, and can probably have it's scaling and mod slots reversed.

[Item=Carved jade Fishing Spear] Cork tipped cutlass has healing, give this thing healing. (at 750mil in the antique shop you could probably find some other ways to buff this thing too...)

Take this from 25 or 75 magma defense, and you still have a weapon that people in tier 9 will almost never use, but they might think about it from time to time.

[Item=blackmoons war plate] I would say go big with this thing. Try 25 icon all block multiuse with the heal and take away the curse. If it's oppressively overpowered, nerf it back down, but this thing always looked like it should have so much potential, and it has always sucked.

Defensive weapons are only good if you can rely on the defense. Why couldn't this just be a straight 90 ice defense? At a BARE minimum, why couldn't this just always block at least 50 ice or 50 ice + sometimes 50 phys. The item description on this thing was such a tease lol. You literally made a troll challenger, but putting 50 Ice defense in the description and then having it randomly disappear, that was the biggest battle troll of all time.

[Item=Dark Goddess Rod] As the back up high end light defense item, that fact that its attack is pretty mediocre AND is spread over 4 icon types has always been annoying to me since the only other real light blocking option with a heal is Mstaff. Can we at least upgrade the attack to 20-22 Dark and 12-18 Air (same attack range, smaller spread). Upping the heal from 5-8 to 7-8 also seems reasonable, but even if only the range was narrowed I would be ecstatic.

[Item=Malerias Cursed Arm Bangle] A classic midrange weapon. Doesn't nessacarilly need to be changed, but it would be nice if the spread was reduced from all 9 icons to either Mono Dark 34 icons or at least a narrower range like 20 Dark 14 Air. It would be a small upgrade without having too much impact. But the people who are forced to use it for budget reasons get a little much punch out of it in practice.

[Item=Ancestral Unrest] Can we get a 4th mod slot on this and a total of 100 icons of defense. It feels like it should be a god weapon, its just almost cosmetically not there...

A boss prize so lame that we kinda got bored and didn't even really finish testing it. Make the base stats block at least 80-90 water, and the boosted stats should probably get an upgrade too.

[Item=Baal] The attack on this thing is nice, but it would be nice, and not game breaking to up the mod slots for 1 to 3 or 4, and to increase the magma defense to 90. Neither of those things would be game breaking, but they would make it a little more interesting.

I'll admit I use this thing, however, that is on an extreme margain of having the 5th biggest pet on the site with ton's of AP for scrolls to compensate for the terrible negative heal. It was also recently brought to my attention that Baal has basically the same damage range, with less draw back, and is a tier lower. I think you could safely remove the negative heal all together, or up the icons substantially, or a combination of both.

I always love the posts you make about diving deeper into the battle scene (stuff like this, or scroll/weapon ideas, or that post about the 300/300/900/300 training build), I feel like it really helps me to understand how these things work a little better.

I haven't really used any of these, I'm not quite there yet w/ my battle pet, but my god does the weird me out. 25k tokens, randomly t12, not very good... i don't think I understand that one. at least it's pretty ¯(ツ)/¯

750 mil for a T9 weapon that doesn't heal lolol

adding to the list, the thing that immediately comes to mind is I used to recommend this for a dark block, but with the lack of heal at early tiers and then only a minimal heal and lackluster dark block at high tiers it's not worth using. In general, make scaling weapons more worthwhile. The minotaur knocker is decent at lower tiers but quickly becomes outclassed T9+. The trident/blessed trident is the only one worth while at both low and high tiers.

I would argue AU is fine the way it is. It was meant to be a semi-god weapon, not god weapon. I think the chance at the 50% heal and ability to block light or dark in addition to physical makes up for 1 less mod slot.

that's weird that baal only has 1 mod slot. I agree that it could at least be increased to 3 without being game breaking. I feel like that was done intentionally to encourage the creation of cronus.

It's not even that terrible though. It's just weird that it's so similar to a tier 11 with less of a drawback and probably more rare

Its definitely still a solid weapon, it just still feels like it should just be a tiny bit better. It has "90" heal, but 20 of that is unreliable, which subtracts a little from it (and in my opinion, it subtracts a lot). It also definitely feels like it should be a 4 mod weapon.

I usually think of it as being one of the new gods, and not necessarily a demigod. It's a limited release from a non-recurring plot (unlike Panzer Gauntlet which is even weaker, but still keeps coming back.). Between TKSS, Malhuili, and AU. AU seems to be a little weaker on the raw power scale (while Mal sees less use just because its a weird combo of icons to block.).

I guess with the way I titled the board, it makes it sound like some of these things are trash, but I made it a little more broad than I was initially thinking when I came up with the topic. It's not that it sucks, it just feels slightly underpowered for its rarity, and Adding 10 defense and a mod slot isn't an earth-shattering change :P.

I can never remember what comet flash does. But If in tier 7 its only defending 15 dark, I would think you could probably safely double that to 30, maybe even 40. Single icon defense weapons in general can probably all get upgrades across the board. Even the god weapons could probably go up to 150 or even 200 to give the middle weapons a little more range to play with. Even at 200 defense it's only blocking 4300 on a 7500 defense pet, which seems like a lot in the current meta where every opponent and every weapon has such a huge range, but could still be easily overpowered by an opponent that does a single mono icon type (which currently doesn't exist.)

[edit] I always forget that Pirate Cutlass in Tier 7 blocks 60 and Turbo Heater blocks 50.

that's a nice list of things you own ^_^

anything antique shop tho, from the pirates/islander plot that retails for like 250-750m in the shop but that no one will ever buy for that. its a waste of a nice sp sink

I've said it before and I'll say it again - I like the legendaries being T5 but they should be some of the best weapons at that tier. People new to battling already expect them to be and there's no good reason for them to get excited only to find out that they're not.

The argument has been made that they should be made T1 and scale, but I disagree with that. One of the great things about leveling up is not just getting to beat new challengers but to get to use new weapons and having the legendaries be really good at T5 helps to give new battlers that goal.

For these same reasons, the legendary combos should be some of the best weapons at T7.

There are like 12 weapons above T6 I don't own lol. Also, I don't sell anything anymore :P.

Making Legends the best T5 weapons and making combos the best T7 weapons wouldn't justify their price takes of 40mil-120mil and 80mil-240mil respectively. (Lucent being the exception)

I think your actually referencing one of my previous posts, and what I actually said was just dunk the Legends in T1, and have them have T5 stats in T1, which to justify buying a 40mil weapon in Tier 1 is pretty much what you would need to do.

This could probably be its own forum topic, but if you really wanted to make legends and combos viable to the non-collector**, they need to be the best, and they need to retain value over a wide spectrum, since most people can use various loot and MC weapons at specific tiers to advance through content for 10-20mil per weapon. 40mil per weapon in T1-8 is a pretty huge investment compared to any other weapons that people buy.

I would probably have made the combo Legends T10 personally, and given them all 10% heal. Really the only way to make them viable from a price standpoint is to make them endgame viable. MCAB is only 20-60mil.

The other better solution to the combos would be to make them actual unique weapons instead of making them formulaic clones of eachother. Make one of them a super high icon attacker, make more of them high end dual duty weapons, make some of them shields, make some of them OPB, ect.

**Disclaimer - I have a full set of Legends and a Full set of Combos, they are sitting in Captain's treasure right now.

I'd definitely would like to see some existing weapons get buffed as opposed to getting new weapons entirely. We need better dark blockers, stat. The ones we do have...well, the best is rather pricey (MCore) if you don't earn one from a Gelatin War (which is now bi-annual to keep control on how many cores go out, among other things). The Slayer only heals when used against gelatins. Plus, we've got so many "dark" looking weapons that should block dark, but they block light? Dark Goddess Rod looks like a dark blocker at first glance, but it's not. Same with Hydra tooth.

Maybe i'm just forgetting about a dark blocker that already exists that doesn't suck at high tiers. I dunno. Correct me if i'm forgetting anything.

also, I really, really want to see the species-specific weapons that are in the MC actually get a boost when used by their respective species. Like the . When used by a Neela, make it boost to 10% heal, add in a small attack or defense boost (20 points so it's not OP for a T8), give it a block and maybe pump up those attacking icons a bit more. Heck, maybe just reduce it to three attack icons as well as juice'em up, but the one removed becomes the element it blocks. I know, species-specific weapons aren't cool or might pigeon-hold users into what species they'd make their battle pet, but we can own so many pets, that it shouldn't matter. It doesn't have to be a lot of weapons or armor either, like the cheap ones sold in the shops. Just one nice weapon for each species.

I think the problem is this big misconception of low tier weapons need to have below average stats, same for scaling weapons. But that's false. If I'm going to invest 50mil+ for one weapon than it should be something I could use for multiple tiers and who cares if it is OP for a T1 or whatever low tier pet. The limiting factor there is stats anyway and shouldn't be weapons. Using 's example of legendary combos, if you leave them at the same stats but make them T1 then they would be really good weapons to have up to T5 or T6 until you could get other weapons. That would justify them being so expensive. Same with the antique shop weapons. A T9 weapon that costs 750 mil and doesn't even heal? What a waste that no one will buy. Add heal, and make it usable at multiple tiers by either beefing up the stats so that it can be used at T9+ or scale it from T1-T9

The problem with leaving them at the same stats but changing them to T1 is that would make every other weapon from T1-T4 that isn't a full healer or blocker automatically obsolete. That's why I favour keeping them at T5 but making them good enough until you can combine them at T7 (though if they're that good it would invalidate my own argument and make every other weapon from T5-T6 obsolete).

I've also suggested before creating new combos from the legendary combos, maybe at T9 where there is a lack of really good weapons and have those good enough to carry someone through to T11. Either that, or have them among the best at T7, useful at T8, and then have them worth holding on to and something we can combo at T12 to create new weapons at that tier that can fill in some of the needs we have there.

It actually wouldn't make them obsolete at all, because there is a price barrier behind the legends. If anything, LGC, TotBO, and RMK already do cause the problem your talking about to a much more polarizing extent.

The entire economy that currently exists for T1-T4 weapons would be untouched. Everyone would still be capable of clearing the same content they previously could because the challengers were balanced around the crappy T1-T4 weapons.

Plus There are only really a handful of truly optimal weapons in Tier 1-4, to begin with, so by creating a set of high-end alternatives, you are actually increasing the diversity of weapons.

The problem with combos of combos is that you compound the problem that already exists with the combos - They are too expensive to be worthwhile in the long run. Why would I spend 160-600mil on a mediocre T9 weapon when I can just buy Ether, Swash, OHS at T10-T11

The Combo Legends are not terrible weapons once you can combine them with Sentinel. I use them all the time. But I could afford them. They are some of the best midrange weapons in the game, but then you hit T10 and there is a 40mil alternative that is better. 99% of people are not going to shell out for combo legends and a Sentinel just to use them for a couple of months. (Aspersion and Acidtonge are the 2 I use, so about 130mil for the pair since one is a lucent combo)

I've kinda changed my mind about the best way to approach the legends/combos problem. I think the best way they could tackle the problem would be to actually bump them up a couple of tiers, and make them Demi-god weapons and put them in T9 or T10.

It won't make any of the other weapons obsolete, it just makes the really expensive options more viable. You're not taking away options, you are adding more. Your new players or people that only casually battle can still buy the budget weapons at low tiers and obtain the same results. The legendary weapons like they are today are only mediocre because although they pack a punch, they still have weapon flaws (no heal without sentinel, low block) and cost more money than justified. Why would I buy a combo legendary that costs 80 mil from the MC at T7 when in T8 I have better options that only cost 5 mil? If the combo (still 80 mil from the MC combo) is now considered a T1 weapon, I can at least consider it a long term investment and use it for my pet until he is T8 and even use it for my other battle pets.

Effectiveness =/= weapon stats, Effectiveness = weapon stats + pet stats. The weapon will only ever be as good as your pet so a tier 7 pet will more effectively use a weapon like moonshine than a T1 pet.

Small point but the Combo Legends + Sentinel are probably, by a razor-thin margin, the best weapons in Tier 8 and 9, Especially aspersion and acid tongue . They deal more damage than any other weapon, and healing in those tiers already kinda sucks, but its still 5% and 6%, but you're up against Large gutting Knife at 7@ and then in T9 the Battle shop weapons which give you a big damage cut for 7-9% heal.

Then in Tier 10 they are absolutely gutted by cheaper more effective weapons.

feels sad you forgot about it? unless im reading your post incorrectly, but that is a perfectly strong high tier dark blocker that remains one of the most accessible end game weapons.

I think they are referring to the fact that the only real viable dark blockers are SSB, ME, and Slayer which are all unobtainable outside of gelatin wars.

is the closest thing to a dark blocker that is readily available, and even those have dried up off the shop search.

I was reminded about blocking dark, but the fact that this and the MSOB only have 1 mod slot is ridiculous. T1 scaling or not, they should have at least 3 mod slots.

I think the bigger problem is that CWS and MSOB are great tier 7 weapons, but only heal 50HP. I would rather see them at 5% heal before extra mod slots.

3 Mod slots turn low tier weapons into God weapons very quick. With 3 EOR mods they would probably be the best tier 1-4 attacking weapons with the exception of LGC

This, basically. There's also the AU, but again, plot prize. I forgot about the rod, but then again, it has no heal, so no wonder it never comes to mind. I feel like T6 to T8 is such an awkward phase for weapons. We could either use some new dark blockers, or buff existing, more readily available ones.

Or we get those high tier healing crystals released, and can mod our weapons accordingly. Think if those were released, had a consistent heal (none of this occasionally heals, or heals either 5HP or 5% BS), but obviously limited to one per weapon. Kinda like how we can only bring one (Freezer) into battle.

I don’t see better options for low tiers as a bad thing though. It will just justify the investment. I think the 50 hp is fine if you give it the the 3 mod slots. 5% and the slots would be too much. Ngl, I used MSOB with an EoR to get wins with my mid T11 pet on melman and it worked pretty well. The lack of attack was the only flaw as it made me esstentially battle with one weapon. Adding two more slots gives you the flexibility of adding other things like parched or crit strike.

The other thing you could do with it is just make it tier 6 or 7 and then give it mod slots. It’s not really used before tier 6 anyways.

Healing mods were dumb. They were the clear best mods no question asked before they got nuked.