She keeps popping her head up and staring intently at the window. In her defense, she's only ever seen rain twice, and I don't think she knows what it is.

Anyone else have exotics? That covers all *legal pets that aren't farmyard animals, dogs, or cats.

*I will make a personal exception for foxes, ferrets, and gambian pouched rats since they're basically illegal on a technicality (and some aren't illegal in certain places), but that's it. Your slow loris/tiger/etc stories will make me cry; save 'em for someone else.

I had a corn snake, MaryAnne, who was afraid of her own food. It didn't matter if I fed her live or prekilled. She managed to eat, but I imagine she felt like a mighty hero after overcoming her terrifying meals (a large DEAD mouse vs. a large corn snake). She also liked to play in her water dish. She also used her terrarium thermometer and hygrometer as a jungle gym. She was an odd little thing, but I loved her very much.

Awwww, noodle! xD I saw a baby python using its water as a jacuzzi at a pet store once, lol. He just parked in there.

I could never own a snake, not while I have rats. The people in my life rn don't listen to a word I say, and I feel like the second I go off on a trip or something they would feed the snake my rats thinking that's what they're for. I really wouldn't be surprised.

I always bought prekilled in bulk for that reason and made it abundantly clear to whoever was taking care of my babies that her food was in the freezer, not in the cage. The mantra I always told myself while owning both was, "One is MaryAnne's food and life source, the other is a pet." It seemed to work, though I can easily see where other folks have trouble. Rats and mice are awfully cute and you can't always help feeling at least a little bad for them, so sometimes you have to emotionally detach a bit from the situation.

Edit: Rats are smart as hell, too. That's why I only fed her mice.

That's the thing though - it's not that kind of accident. They don't dislike my rats, they just have something to prove and not much behind the wheel.

See, I have a mental disability and the people in my life rn are bigots. They actively choose to shut me out, because they think it would be shameful not to. So they don't listen, they brush me off, and then they try and figure it out themselves later with basically zero instruction and no desire to get it right. They'd make that kind of mistake because they're rushing and have no idea what they're doing, and aren't thinking of what I'd want from them so much as trying to straddle the difference between hatred and fear of repercussion.

I don't have any proof of that, thankfully, it's just something I'm worried about because it really would not be outside their character to make such a colossal mistake.

& yeah, that's why I'd feed them dead things, not live. God help me if a live one decides to be affectionate! Dead things can't give kisses, so down the hatch they go.

I wouldn't mind feeding dead rats. I dissected a rat and cat in school while owning both of those things at home. I figure if I can get through three weeks of slowly taking Fluffy apart, I can quickly feed one to a snake. They gotta eat. ¯|(..)_|¯

Are you fucking kidding me? What kind of psychopaths are you living with? I understand disliking somebody, but taking it out on their pets is taking it waaay too far. That's disgusting. You don't deserve to be around people like that, and I'm glad you seem to know that. There's no shame in mental disability whatsoever. None.

And oh man, I couldn't dissect a cat. I grew up with them and love them too much (not that you love them any less). I can barely stand the sight of a dead one. But it's a very "me" thing. I'm very okay with others doing it and I understand it's for science. Dissecting a rat might be a little tough, but I could do that.

@ Sheherself It's not taking it out on them so much as being too careless and lacking good sense. They would feel really bad once they learned what they'd done (although I'd still want to skin them alive). My only point is that, against all odds, it genuinely might happen, purely because they're just so indescribably stupid and snotty and dramatic. Oh the dramatics. It's like they're three.

I'm proud of that part of me, honestly. Sure, I struggle sometimes, but doesn't everyone? Why is me struggling in different ways from the norm such a tragedy? It bothers me deeply when people call my peeps "sufferers." No suffering here. The people I'm living with aside.

Yeah, I get that. Your take is honestly probably a lot closer to "normal." I'm very much a dude, haha. I'm really, uh... deprived... when it comes to sentimentality. Here's my best example: When I came out to my family I did it with a two word group text and only did it at all cause I basically had to. It was just never important to me that they know. Took me ages to figure out why that last detail upset my parents so much. So deprived. 8'D

The cat was hard for me to dissect in other ways, though. Its fur soaked up all the fluids and they didn't come skinned, so we had to skin them over a tub cause the fur itself AND the space between the skin and meaty bits was so swollen with fluid we physically couldn't skin them over the trays, the room would be a mess. The smell was... special. That was the only time someone puked.

Fucking hell. Some people are just so stupid that they simply can't learn, and for some reason they make it other people's problem. But I understand your point, and I want to hit them over the head with something heavy. I don't like admitting hatred, but I hate willfully ignorant people.

OHHHHH MYYYY GOOOOOOD. People need to STOP calling us "sufferers." You said everything. The real tragedy is able-minded bigots who decide to make our lives harder because they can't be bothered to even attempt to understand us. Oh wait, maybe that's why we're "sufferers."

My stepdad and sister were really great when I came out. They were supportive and loving and very there for me (my stepdad is there for me if a sneeze is emotionally hard on me, he's awesome). It was my mom who thought I would just "grow out of" being gay just because I came out when I was a teenager, so it was obviously just a phase. She didn't understand why I became even more rebellious after that. But it's been 10 years since then and her views on the subject have changed dramatically, so our relationship has improved tenfold.

As for the cats, oh my god. I know all about those "special smells" and dear god, NO.

It just ends up being everyone else's problem cause the slack has to be picked up somewhere. People that dumb aren't even consciously aware they're causing slack. :'D

I'm the opposite w/re to hate. If it mildly annoys me, I "hate" it.

LOL I was just going to say that. xD Able-minded morons see us suffering their BS and go "awww how sad".... and then keep right on it. Sigh. The worst is when the parents say "we" and start talking about what "we" want and then you actually listen and they're saying that their kid, who isn't mentally capable of understanding that level of sacrifice, "wants" to do things that would permanently scar them mentally or physically solely for the parents' convenience. Like ABA or that new thing where they mess with their bones to keep them child-sized forever. I hate the able-minded, they're fucking brutal.

My family was supportive (except my dad), they were just hurt cause I gave the impression that they didn't mean much to me. I'd -meant- that my lgbt-ness wasn't a big deal to me so them knowing just wasn't a priority. xD Oops.

My dad did that too! He said to give it 5 or 10 years first and not to "rush into anything." I went ???

It wasn't even just them, it was the liquid preservatives. They were so bloated... it was gross. ;_; I was very glad when that part was over. Looked less like a cat from then on too.

What in the blue fuck....? Why would they.....? Child-sized forever? How could they make that decision for us? Why are our experiences so invalid and wrong? Why aren't they questioning their own behavior? What the hell gives them the fucking right?

ABLE-MINDED PEOPLE ARE A FUCKING PAIN.

I've never been diagnosed as autistic, but I know I am in some areas on the spectrum because I experience so many similar thing that autistic people talk about, and that a doctor probably wouldn't diagnose me because I have a set of ovaries. Even though I have meltdowns, sensory sensitivities, I flap my hands when I get really excited and happy, etc. That and I just don't experience things "normally."

I think some parents, when confronted with a "not according to plan" child, just try to move around whatever it is that's come up with some lame reasoning to soothe themselves. Then when things don't change, they just adjust like a normal human would in the first place. But whatever, at least they adjusted. Gotta take the good with the bad, right? sigh

Have a look: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2007/jan/04/health.topstories3 The claim is that if their immobile child got bigger, they wouldn't be "able" to carry her around anymore. Her body is basically atrophied, I'm pretty sure they could move her into a wheelchair if they wanted to. They just felt that it would be cumbersome to move a teenager instead of a 6-year-old (when the treatments started), and didn't want to deal with that.

Every source goes into the sterilization, which is a problem but the kid has the brain of a 3 month old that can't even roll over; I guarantee you she didn't want kids. No one talks about the ethics of opening the floodgates for people to force non-consenting disabled children of all varieties into an eternal childhood. There's currently no regulations on this whatsoever, and since parents are considered the ones who make the calls for these kids, nothing can stop them. Down's Syndrome? Cerebral Palsy? Autism? They can't talk, so they can't think, right? Hey, that's hard on the parents, they're in their forties and that's just so very old and weak. Disabled people don't have real lives anyway. They don't deserve the opportunities the abusive possessive helicopter parents don't want them to have.

I've been diagnosed, but it was never made an official diagnosis. My parents put a stop to that. Not sure why. I know they're in denial about it but they're the ones that sought the testing in the first place... >_>

There's actual self-help books about dealing with not getting your "dream child." People are just resistant to diversity in every possible way, against all odds and common sense. They expect their kids to be just like them, like the same things they like, struggle the same ways they struggle, perform where they had performed, etc... and when things are different, they shut it out. They'd rather do whatever they can to pretend that everything's fine.

Instead of dealing with my struggles, mine used to shout over me and cut me off until I stopped protesting and then flick a switch and expect me to pretend with them that nothing happened, that their way was the right way, that I could do it just fine, everything's fine, etc. It's like they didn't want to be parents anymore.

See, this is why I'm uncertain about becoming a parent. Because I'm not sure about how I would deal with a kid who was radically different from me. I mean, I would love them just the same, but I might treat them differently, and not the good kind of differently. I mean, Jesus wept, I wouldn't put them into a perpetual childhood. But I know I wouldn't make the best mother under some hypothetical circumstances. I'm big enough to admit that. But all I get from the world around me is, "But all women want babies! A woman's life is incomplete without becoming a mother!"

As for "real lives", if someone is conscious and able to perceive their their own reality on a sensible level, it's a real life. It's literally that easy. It doesn't matter if it's a bit "outside the box" or whatever. It's cool and fine. Leave 'em be. As for being nonverbal, there are so many different ways of communicating. Not everyone talks.

Parents tend to fail to understand their kids aren't their little clones. And even if they were, they were born on a different timeline with a whole new set of life experiences happening to them. (Sorry, I just got done watching a bunch of Rick and Morty.) But that's not the point. The point is, you get my point. Kids aren't Mini-Mes. We're our own people, and no amount of sterilization and ABA or whatever they threaten us with can take that away from us.

Fuck 'em.

I HAAAATE people like that!! Fact that I'm not a woman notwithstanding, I hate kids. I've never been good with them and I see no reason why I'd suddenly start once I had one. :T My only motivation to keep one would be to prove that you don't need to be abusive to raise them right, which is a purely self-fulfilling reason that won't actually change anything cause abusive people will never believe they're wrong, which is WHY they're abusive in the first place. So no, I REALLY don't want any. And yet, I will always be "wrong."

Right. No intelligent person thinks language is a factor when it comes to intelligence. It's what language represents, which is communication. Communication can take an infinite number of increasingly subtle forms, all of which are capable of being understood by someone other than the communicator. To say that such things aren't like language and its practitioners can't be sentient if that's all they have purely because they aren't sounds coming from the mouth is stupid.

Here's where I, personally, draw the line: If someone or something can form coherent, independent thoughts, they are sentient and deserve basic rights, dignity being one of them. Autonomy, it depends (wild animals approaching extinction can't fend for themselves, for example) but dignity? Yes, they deserve dignity. You have to consider the ethics of what it is you're doing. You can't assume that it's okay if they don't know any better (or worse yet, just assume that they don't because you don't understand them when they try to communicate with you). That's taking advantage purely because you think you can get away with it. That's abuse.

I hate ABA. Anyone that sends their kid to ABA needs to have their kid(s) taken away from them. The seemingly innocuous punishments doled out for failing to perform (which is abusive in its own right) are sadistic for us. I heard that one place forced the kids to stand up and sit down repeatedly, which just seems like mild physical exercise... but not when you know what happens inside our heads when we do that because of our spatial awareness issues (namely, our world spins like a snowglobe). It's essentially trapping the kid in a centrifuge until they panic, for shit like not holding eye contact. It's just an all-day, daily torture session for people that can't collect their thoughts enough to cry or articulate what's wrong and believe that reacting in any way is misbehavior, all for the sake of getting their allistic parents children that are as allistic as they can get 'em. They don't want happy autistic children, they want severely broken ones with allistic masks glued to their faces. They don't want to adapt, they want to see autism as a series of behavioral issues they can punish into oblivion. They want to believe that if their kid is forced to act like them, they'll be happier that way, purely because the PARENT will be happier that way.

I'm an infertile, biologically speaking, female. Despite my username, I'm actually agender. But what I mean is, I would like children (despite the previously stated reasons, call it self-loathing or simple fear) but can't have any myself. I have multiple conditions where I would most likely benefit from a full-blown hysterectomy, BUT SWEET CHRIST IN HEAVEN NOOOO! THE BABIES!!! Apparently adoption isn't a thing that exists.

Language can be used to decipher intellect, but definitely isn't necessary. There are times when I go non-verbal, and I just write things down. Sometimes I use a text-to-speech app on my phone. Both work. There's also a near-infinite number of other ways that don't involve technology, though it does help. Thank the stars for accessibility, limited as it is.

I really like that third paragraph, especially. It's difficult to comment further. You said it all so thoroughly.

I've never been sent to ABA (to which mercy may I give thanks) and I'll admit I don't know a whole lot about it. I just know a lot of really terrible stuff goes down. I've only heard whispers. It's like a conversion school, only for autistic kids instead of gay ones, right? Or no? I try reading up on the precise nature of these institutions, and getting stories from the kids that were sent there, but all I get is stuff written by allistic people. It's difficult to trust. Could you maybe fill me in a bit, please? I need (and want) to know and really understand as best I can.

Ah, gotcha. More to that point, I heard that not only is it impossible to get a medically necessary hysterectomy (electives aside), but that the people that do get them are looked down on and it's assumed they don't want or like kids. If your life dream was to have a child and children were your lifeblood, people would casually ask you why you didn't want children or be surprised that you're fond of them. There's literally nothing about getting a hysterectomy that isn't hell, and it's only because of how people treat you. People suck.

Language can certainly be an indicator (although it definitely isn't w/re to AI), it's just not the greatest place to put the line since there's just way too many other ways to express intelligence.

Using tools is another common place to put the line that isn't the greatest. Dolphins, for example. Super intelligent, no tools. They have flippers and live in a level of the ocean where there's literally nothing around but other dolphins and fish, so it's hard to blame 'em. Another example: beavers. They build, and their dams shape the ecosystem around them. Intelligent? Not remotely. Scientists stuck a pair of speakers on dry ground that played water noises and the local beavers stuck a dam on them.

Thanks! ;D

Me neither, but I was on tumblr for a couple of years and learned a bit from people who used the site as a medium to get their voices heard. One of the people that posted used to work at a location that offered ABA services, and she quit because she couldn't handle it. They would do the stand-sit thing or spray vinegar/hot sauce into the kids' mouths for failing to hold eye contact or speak or suppress their stimming. Whatever form of sensory torture the creative mind can think of, basically. I find it sickening that they chose that angle specifically because we have acute senses. They knew it would be torment, so that's what they picked and why. For children. Sickening.

There's some semantics issues between conversion therapy and ABA, but that's the basic idea, yes. If I can remember my tumblr password, I'll try to find that post for you. It may have linked to a site with more info.