I recently tried submitting a CW for the first time. I found the submission page to be very lacking in important information. For example, when I chose the "Full Backgrounds and Foregrounds" option for type of item, it was listed under "5,000 CSC." But then, in the box talking about submitting items directly to the cash shop, it said "Full Backgrounds and Foregrounds that take up more than 50% of the HA cost: 1,600 CSC." I had to ask other members of the site what the 5,000 CSC price was for, because it wasn't actually explained anywhere on that page. The little "?" icon next to "Type of Item" directed me to a post that no longer exists.

There was also no mention of your CSC being returned to you if your submission is denied. I would think this is a detail that most people would like to know, given the price of submitting an item in the first place.

My submission was denied, but the reasons given for the denial were not mentioned anywhere on the submission page. First off, the item icon was problematic because it had a drop shadow. This is easy enough for me to fix for a future submission, but why is that requirement not mentioned on the list of item standards? Not to mention that there are several non-CW items on the site that do have drop shadows in their item icon:

So, if the CW submission page says "should match up with our level of quality and style," then why is my image being judged by what appears to be a different standard?

My biggest issue, however, is this note about the background image itself: "Unfortunately, we do not accept photo manipulations as submissions and cannot continue to critique this until this has been addressed!" Again, nowhere on the submission page does it say that photo manipulations are not accepted. The "manipulation" in this case was cropping an image to meet the necessary dimensions, minor editing to remove a few rocks, and slight adjustments to contrast. The photo that was manipulated was a photo of my own, which I mentioned in my submission. For reference, here is the image I submitted (with a watermark added):

Also, the note on my denial said that my item cannot be critiqued further until this issue had been addressed. How am I supposed to address the fact that my submission was a manipulation of a photo? The absolute only way I can think of would be to create an entirely new CW from scratch, which renders the "continue to critique" bit a moot point. Plus, I essentially received no helpful critique in the first place. The reasons given for my denial are inconsistent with both the submission guidelines available to me and other items on the site.

In short, the CW submission page does not have sufficient information about what factors are actually looked at during review of the item. It also does not have sufficient information about the economics of CWs (price of submitting the item for review, how to price an item once it is accepted, what percentage of the profits go to Subeta vs the CW creator, etc). The feedback on a rejected submission is also completely unhelpful. I request that the CW submission page be updated to provide more helpful and more accurate information.

I don't know much about CWs, but those items you listed are all very, very old and don't represent Subeta's newer art direction. CWs have to adhere to these more current art standards.

My point was more that since there are item icons on Subeta with drop shadows, and since nowhere is it explicitly stated that drop shadows aren't allowed in CW item icons, how are users supposed to know that rule before they submit their CW? If not all of the guidelines are given to users before they get their item rejected, then it just wastes the staff's time and the artist's time.

I think the ? Link is supposed to be this link and likely got broken when it was coded.

As for the lack of guidelines, I don't see them as unclear. [S]I wouldn't be opposed to seeing an added sentence stating do not looking to official items for approval guarentees.[/s] I don't think the site could list every single reason for a denial, especially for something as random/unlikely as a person adding a drop shadow.

In regards to not having notice about not using photo manipulation, I think that's pretty obvious based on the fact that the HAs are done with cell shading and the page says refers in at least two places to items being drawn.

The CW forum is full of helpful people for asking questions, and the staff welcomes tickets as well.

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I thought about the cell shading thing before submitting my item, but several recent background items (such as the snowglobes in the cash shop, or this CW ) have much more detail than cell shading.

Also, just to make this clear, I didn't make this thread because I was butthurt about my submission getting denied or anything. I figured my first submission wouldn't get approved. What I'm annoyed at is the reasons given for the denial. Telling me the item was denied because it was a photo manipulation and that I should fix that is...kind of a nonsensical sentence.

FAQ thread

Thank you for pointing out that bit. But just a bit below that, it does say

In addition, the photo I used is my own. So, the FAQ states that tracing and manipulation of a photograph or work owned by somebody else is not allowed, but that tracing my own photograph would be allowed. Perhaps this comes down to an issue of grammar, but to me that reads as "photograph owned by somebody else or artwork owned by somebody else."

And again, I'm not sure how I'm supposed to fix the fact that it's a photo manipulation and not drawn by hand.

You didn't trace it though. You did no art of the photo. You simply cropped and edited it, which is not allowed.

- In the rules, it says "Your item and overlay images should both have a minimum of 3-5 layers of shading." Although it doesn't explicitly state that cell shading is the site standard (which it probably should), it is.

As far as your submission goes, they don't accept photomanipulations as far as I'm aware. You'll have to draw a background from scratch (or by tracing the photo in a vector graphics program) in order to 'fix it'.

Erm... Please reread the paragraph I wrote underneath what I quoted.

Also, it's not really a case of "simply" cropping and editing the photo? I also, y'know, took the photo in the first place. And I've kind of been honing my photography skills for several years now. This wasn't just a point-and-shoot kind of thing.

But I digress. I'd rather this conversation be more focused on the CW submission process in general than solely on my specific submission, please. I gave the details of my submission to explain my site feedback, not to complain about getting denied. I'm open to talking about what was wrong with my submission, but I'm guessing this forum is not the best place for that.

I read your paragraph. You can't use photos, period.

Regardless, I do agree that the CWs page needs more information, or needs to at least link to the FAQ page.

Perhaps the site standard of cell shading should either be modified or be more explicitly stated, given all the official background items that have come out lately that do not seem to be cell shaded. Or maybe there should be an exception made for CW background items, if there are official items coming out that are exceptions,

Also, that bit about drawing a background from scratch is my point -- it's not really "fixing" the item if I just submit a totally different item instead. I like the vector graphics program idea, but alas, that sounds like more money than I'd be willing (or able) to invest in creating a CW.

I did say it might come down to an issue of grammar. In which case, I'd suggest to staff that the wording be changed slightly so it's more clear that any photos are not acceptable, regardless of whether or not you own it. The more clear the rules are, the fewer automatic-denial submissions the staff members will have to sort through.

But yes, fixing the link to the FAQ page should probably be the first priority. Especially since that'd just be a matter of modifying the URL in the page's code, which is a relatively simple thing to do.

I think linking to the FAQ would be a great idea.

- Off topic now, but there are a lot of free vector graphics programs available. I like using Inkscape--it's a fairly intuitive open source program. Maybe you could check it out.

The is cell shaded. All CWs must be cell shaded. Subeta staff are now allowing more painty items to pass, which I personally am loving _ but they're still cell shaded.

As for the denial, there's not much more they could have told you. Photomanip isn't allowed, so I'm not sure they could critique anything else. And as for the official items images having dropshadow that doesn't matter. Subeta staff don't need to follow CW guidelines because they aren't drawing CWs.

The Moonlit Fairy Statue certainly doesn't look at all like any cell-shaded works I've ever seen. The colors are all blended together, rather than being distinct blocks.

As I've said, my main issue with the photomanipulation bit was that they said I need to fix that before more critique can be given. I literally cannot change the fact that the image was created from a photo. So it's impossible to "fix" that so I can get further critique on the same item. The staff member's wording was nonsensical.

Ah well it is cell, but you can ping the artist if you want...or it might be up on her livestream still Idk C:

Yes I agree with you that all the info on the FAQ ,under the Customwear forum heading, should be either on the submission page, or at the very least linked. I'd personally like to see a step by step guide but EH hopes, dreams, and wishes lol

To me though fix means to change the fact that it's a photo aka draw it. That way it's pretty much the same scene only painted either by you or someone else. I know Jessi and Darling go through dozens of cws a day plus their other subeta jobs, so they can't give out thorough denial reasons on every CW. However, you can always make a ticket if you're confused about something, I've bothered Jessi many a time when I was unsure of the reason for a denial, and she's always helped me as best as she could.

Hmm Idk if it needs pointing out that CWs =/= official items. But it couldn't hurt to add that in I guess.

In my opinion, drawing it would mean creating an entirely new item, especially if it became cell shaded, thus why the wording seems nonsensical. There's a difference between a thorough denial reason and a denial reason that makes sense.

But yeah, at the end of all of this, I'd just like to see the CW submission page be more informative.