You Won! You have defeated Prodigy You won a(n) Impossible token to use in the battle shop! Kuuipo earned 3500 EXP Points!

I made a 0 speed pet , which is maxed now and it handles any opponent quite well, however any opponent that can deal good damage occasionally hits me like a truck when they crit.

That's definitely what makes a good battler, perseverance. Anyone can get there pet to high enough stats to beat an opponent and take 0 losses. It's getting the wins after 50 losses or hours of struggle that show how tough we are.

Thank you and thank you for the gifts! You didn't have to do that, there's always next year =) I will make something kickass just for you!

Oh that's awesome. What if I invested in a lot of defense then to try and survive crits? I was thinking about this maxed stat build:

Health: 6000 Strength: 4000 Defense: 25000 Speed: 0

The defense would block about 39 per icon, attack would do 15 per icon. Blackmoons war plate would block 273 - 351 of each icon type if I did my math right (7 - 9 icons blocked in each stat). With 6000 in health, a 10% heal would add on 600 hp heal per turn too...

I have no idea how brutal opponents can be once I reach that tier though. I wanted to put a little more in health so that percent heals do more, and I'm more likely to survive things. But maybe it's better to put more in strength so I can hit harder - especially if the opponent has good blocks/defense?

Wow that is a lot of defense. Definitely overkill imo. Defense and health counterbalance each other while speed and strength counter balance. The more you block the more you heal but since defense scales sqt(def)/4, it has a log curve. You are going to reach a point of diminishing return where you gain more by increasing health instead of increasing defense. The same holds true with strength. If you have high speed, you could potentially make make up for little strength by having a better chance to crit hit and double damage. With 0 speed you will want a lot more strength to make up for not being able to do critical damage without the use of mods, and also to end battles quickly to reduce the amount of crit hit damage done to you. Battles will also take a lot longer for opponents with high hp if you don't hit hard enough.

Those are great points, thank you! Especially the point about the diminishing return. I think this is an interesting math problem, actually, I definitely wanna try doing some calculations on this. But I'm not too great with numbers so I will ask my bf ( lol) to do it when he gets home, I think he'll be willing to help. I'll report back if I find anything out.

There are also different weapons you can use depending on what stats you want to build up.

I have a spread sheet created based off of the toughest opponents. It's not perfect since the damage an enemy deals varies depending on what weapons they use but it's enough to give me an idea of what my stats should look like for an attempt at wins.

6k health won't be enough to give you the heal to get through rounds where you're not blocking the right icon against quite a few opponents. defense also prevents crits in a way because the threshold to crit is in some way a comparison of your defense to opponents damage, the specifics aren't out known though (at least certainly not by me lol).

You Won! You have defeated Mutant Scientist 1 time! You won a(n) Impossible token to use in the battle shop! You earned 15000 sP for beating Mutant Scientist! Kilroy___ earned 2248 EXP Points!

About time I was able to pull off one blasted win. That anti-freeze curse is the main issue, combined with her healing.

You Won! You have defeated Prodigy Kilroy___ earned 3500 EXP Points! Head back to the Battle Quest headquarters to finish up this quest! Because this was level 30 you earned 3500 experience!

You're welcome, and your HA look's awesome! :)

@ Mike

I am actually constructing a very interesting table that confirms you will defeat opponents with less stats if you raise health over defense and then another table that compares how much higher your health should be relative to defense.

Thank you! I always have a tough time with backgrounds because I never use them. I find adding a background takes attention away from the actual HA

I asked to do some, well, math for us, to calculate when it would be better to raise health rather than defense. He found a rather interesting result, I've pinged him so he can explain it (as he can do so better than I can)

I also asked him to do strength vs speed, but we can't seem to find a formula for how the speed stat affects things like crits, does anyone know of such a formula?

Basically, health is more effective than defense whenever the defense is at least than b^2 / (8 k^2). b is the number of block symbols of the type, and k is the heal fraction each round (e.g.a heal of 10% each round corresponds to 0.1). Actual effectivness may take place at a lower defense value since more health also increases the survival time, but this depends on the enemy damage relative to the block count.

For example, with 7 block symbols, and a 20% heal each round, this corresponds to a defense value of 7^2 * 5^2 / 8 = 312.5

The derivation amounts to a comparison of derivatives. Assume health and enemy damage are such that the character is neither one-shotted nor immune to damage. Then the reduction is b*sqrt(x)/4 + kh, where x is defense, h is health, and b and k are as above. The derivatives are b/(4sqrt(x)) and k respectively, so comparing when dr/dh is greater gives the above threshold.

I put together a very basic table to start where I looked at health, defense, an enemy's attack and actual damage taken, where actual damage taken depends on your heal and defended icons. The heal is based on the heal of my weapon set. I selected a value for damage taken and looked at three different scenarios ( def > health, def = health and def < health) that would yield the same results. All three result in the same outcome but the total amount of stats differ. You need less total health and def stats (you can face the challenger earliest) if health > def. I even looked at increasing defended icons, but the result is still the same. Again, it's the way health and defense scales. I have more complex models that look at actual opponent attack damage, their defense, speed, and stat scaling to 10 wins.

You do have a lot of different variables. Healing will depend on your tier, but easier opponents also don't hit as hard.

time So sleepy ugh

Thanks Amiga, I get the two mixed up frequently. Crap! I'm a ninny for not asking thought it was a random site event like IceKing

Freakin' yeah!

Scumbag froze me three turns in a row to kill me the previous attempt at no.5 when I had her under 6k health. I was so mad about that, but I healed up and went at it again and here we are. Got a fortunate crit on the... fifth chain-freeze turn IIRC, for around 8k damage. Managed to avoid being frozen at all this round. Feels good! One more foe off of my victory list.

Yeah, I've noticed that recently too when I was messing around with a medieval knight design. Sometimes though you just need a little something extra to make the HA pop, and you definitely got that.

You Won! You have defeated Crawbeast You won a(n) Impossible token to use in the battle shop! Verdugo earned 3500 EXP Points!

there's always next year!

Major congrats! I was just looking to see if I was coming in range of being able to beat her lol

Thanks! Just takes a lot of patience and good freezes. Since you could handle Hoarfrost up to a few wins despite his gimmicks, you might be able to take her on too.

EDIT:

Took a look at his stats compared to The Mad Scientist's and figured all he really had over her was speed, his health was definitely low enough that with chain freezing or crits, I could take care of, and I did just that with only one loss in between! He stole my Cronus Blade and I couldn't out damage his healing so I just gave up after about ten turns. Healed, came right back, and finished up strong!

Now all that is left is Prak and Baenwurath, and those behemoths are getting put on hold until I'm comfortably into T13.

I'm curious as to which opponents you used and whether you used health over 10k. It's certainly less stats to beat an opponent when the heal threshold is lower and health is more effective, but after 10k hp if your opponent often hits for more icons than 3k damage per turn, defense is necessary, though certainly it's unlikely that defense> health will be superior in general. This all being said my current pet I'm working on will probably be capped at 2-3k defense, and my next at 1-2k lol.

the problem with that is that number of icons successfully blocked can vary GREATLY (like 0-10 one round, 150 the next) even with the same opponent turn to turn which really makes a formula like that hard to apply practically, even using statistics.

And then there's opponents healing vs your damage, freezing, etc all in all, to me at least, the real fun in having unbalanced stat builds is seeing which opponent you can beat early and which opponent you actually made more difficult for yourself. An opponent like sophie for instance would be harder with a low str, high def, high health build because out damaging her blocks and heals is somewhat unlikely, although blasting the right things and being able to survive longer with good blocks balances it a bit. Overall against any opponent the best build is going to be one thats just 1 point over the heal threshold with the highest damage output possible, but becuase of the opponent variety it's not so cut and dry.

@ OaZuoM

I think prak is actually easier than mutant scientist. I was able to get him down to 20k health when I had a lot less health and stats in general. He uses the same one weapon gimmick as hoarfrost. AU would be perfect for him.

@ mike

Oh no that was just the basic model to show more health is better if you want to best someone earlier. 3k was just a random number I picked. I looked at higher too, but the principle is still the same. My other models are based off of the castle and look at his damage, defense and takes into account speed. I also have it scaled to 10 win stats. From there I'm going backwards and looking to project when I'm in range for meatslab and the scientist and the rest of the wins for prodigy. I should have done prodigy after I made the model for the castle though since I actually have a win on him.