Referral prizes staying exclusive is understandable. I would like to know the reason behind the huge push for referrals, though.

As I posted a page or two ago, the site struggles to handle the traffic it already has. Any time a large number of users try to do anything - 3:00 account clearings, special site events, even those VIP invite stocks - the site immediately rolls over and dies under the strain.
So what is the reasoning behind this huge push for more users to join, and the fact that even more new referral prizes are being added to the shop, when the site is already struggling to handle the users who are already here? So much of the site is too broken for a new user to enjoy or find a reason to stay. Other sites in this situation often close new membership signups until things are running at full capacity again.

Yeah I think you have to have some leeway. Collections should be completable with enough investment because a game isn't fun if it's impossible; you always need a glimmer of hope to keep you motivated. There are achievements for completing your collections, after all. Collections are something which should always be completable as the items get deleted once they're stuck in there. As I said before though, you guys are the ones with the numbers so I'm sure you have a better idea of items which specifically need attention.

[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/KJzpceI.gif[/IMG]

Ah okay. You had me confused.

I hope that whatever you guys come up with next make it easier for new players. After being here for so long, it's easy to forget that not everyone comes here with knowledge of how to do things that are second-nature to the rest of us. I also hope that the new tutorial will be more interactive and in depth. When I was trying to get my friend to be a player here, I tried to get her to read the "what newbies should do" or whatever thread, that's full of questions and answers, but to be honest, it's really tiring and boring to read through a giant forum post. My point is, I hope some more things can be included in the tutorial such as showing the new user a Subeautique invite and explaining that it comes from random events and show them where and how to use it. Because more than often I see people asking about those things.

Sure, I wasn't specifically talking about referral prizes. :P Just in a general sense. As I said, I'm sure you guys are able to tell whether there are people sitting on lots of points, which, for the right price, could be coerced from them.

If these people don't exist then I think it's a problem.

I don't think I would've stayed when I originally joined if the wardrobe wasn't working properly and I saw how it looks now... I didn't have any help from anyone and I guess I just used my experience from Neopets, like said. XD This is what my boyfriend must have went through (I don't remember a tutorial when I joined). He joined recently of his own accord, because I kept talking about Subeta to him and he saw me playing on here. I would never dream of referring my friends to this site. Heck, I only recently came out to my friends about PLAYING this site because I became addicted to it once again even through all the crap that's going on. XD But my boyfriend had been pretty confused about getting around and making money as well. He ran into the same problem of trying to find quests once you went to go get an item and I had to show him the quest widget thing and basically explained how I make all my sP.

How can you tell how many referrals you have pending? x:

Well I'm done with this board, I think. I'm really glad that things are starting to get fixed finally (OUTSIDE OF THAT PHANTOM NEWS POST), and I hope it stays that way and the new ping group keeps getting used. It would be nice to not have these boards happen to get some stuff fixed.

I'm thankful one of our battle admins was nice enough to say the cap hasn't been forgotten, and that some user was nice enough to sell a few of us referral items n__n Bless them as well as the super awesome person who told me someone was selling ;o;o; ❤️

All I want now is the pet page to load at a reasonable speed (even 10-15 seconds is cool) and I'm content.

To be really honest, if you find a game to be struggling, you might be on Subeta for the wrong reasons.

Now THAT'S fucked up. Have you ever ever ever had a customer service job before? Because despite what "game developer" job you think you have now, this is a customer service job and a developer job. You have to do both.

The first year here IS hard. YOUR game is broken. YOUR forums are broken. YOUR cults are broken. YOUR wardrobe is broken. YOUR NEWBIE WALKTHROUGH IS BROKEN FOR FUCKS SAKE. Over the last year alone we've had countless outages, unbearable lag, etc etc etc. There SHOULD be something for staying for a year, because those yearlings haven't invested as much as anyone else (time, money, creativity) and have every reason to find something better. Especially when they're deliberately made to feel unwelcome in a fucked up attempt to be snarky by the site owner.

We get a loyalty box the 2nd year and so far every year after that. Why not the first year? That's what I don't understand, maybe I'm just missing something. I'm not saying I'm not appreciative of what we do get, it just hasn't ever made sense to me. 365 days is a long time to be committed to something that's half-broken from the start though.

I know you and the rest of the staff are working on things and that's great to hear.

As long as staff keeps an eye on the availability of collectibles, which has been reassured, I guess that's all we could ask and I'm done with that part of the discussion as well.

(Now, still on the newbies subject!)

Once upon a time, my account turned one year old. I was a little surprised the other years had prizes but not the first, so, a while after my account anniversary, I inquired around. The answer I got from a long-time member was that, years before, the community had decided that one year "wasn't enough" time/dedication to warrant the goodies that come within a LB.

I was a little disappointed to hear that, as I had put a lot of effort into my account on the first year. Of course I wasn't going to question it at that point, who was I to question a veteran community decision?! I considered suggesting something, but I thought people would read it as "she wants free stuff" so I quickly dropped the idea. I wasn't too active on the forums yet, too, so opening threads (especially suggestions) was a bit scary.

Fast forward some time, I think it was last year around Christmas when I finally opened that suggestion board. As I already knew giving new users a LB had been decided against, I suggested pretty much any gift, but quickly a little 1-month GA totem felt like it would be the nicest option. (I still think it could be something else as well!) There was some support to the suggestion back then, but eventually it faded and became a necro.

If there are newbies today that feel anything like I did, supposing they can use the forums (language barrier), they're very unlikely to suggest changes to this, not to be labeled a 'beggar'. The reason why I do, and why I'm insisting a bit on it, is that I know I felt a bit underappreciated to basically see my one-year loyalty "wasn't enough". I know I would have been happy with even a thank you bear, a piece of cake or idk, some sort of message saying 'Thanks for sticking with us for a whole year! We're very happy to see you around, we hope you stay for many more years to come!" as recognition for what was, for me, a huge milestone at the time. It might sound really silly and probably a personal thing, but I felt like my first year was my biggest accomplishment in terms of loyalty.

There are many reasons besides site difficulties for me to think newbies should get a little gift. For me, it's more about recognition, about making them feel welcomed! It doesn't have to be the same gift at all if that's an issue, it's more to celebrate their presence and the fact that they're finally not a "new user" anymore.

I think the trick to improve newbies' experience is (for those of us who can) to not forget how we were when we were newcomers too. (:

Nowadays, my LBs sit forever locked on my inventory, as I don't have a use for them just yet. I don't really care much about them anymore, but I would've liked that piece of cake back then. I would still love if something like this ever happened, and I am definitely glad the whole process for newcomers is being improved. ^_^

I agree. As a fairly new user, I was disappointed to see that I won't get anything after a year here. It's certainly not a big enough deal to make me quit the site before a year is up, but some kind of one year loyalty gift would be nice. (Like, say, a BALLOON. But I'm a little biased...) It has nothing to do with "deserving" it, the way Keith put it:

From this perspective, no one "deserves" a loyalty gift. What disappointed me is the fact that every year AFTER one gets a loyalty gift, which implies that we newer users don't matter as much. I guess we don't, but I was still disappointed. (Although honestly, the only loyalty item I'm interested in is the pet slot totem.)

Okay I lied, I'm not done rotf.

Just to point out that seeing that you get nothing for the first year, but for every other year is just disheartening. Like every other year is important but that first year isn't?

I don't think it's so much that people expect something for the first year. It's that they'd like to have something for the first year, too. It's just kinda like, well if everyone else gets a cookie why can't I have a cookie, too? I like the idea of a 1 month GA suggested, or just.. a little something' to say thank you.

And I apologize if it sounded like I was unconstructively yelling at you, because while I was internally screaming I wasn't trying to relay out utterly exasperating and dejecting it is to feel, and get the vibe from staff, that "petsites are out, so pet people might as well be" "yeah I know it lags for some people but that's your problem not the sites" "it's not my fault y'all aren't social, deal with it". Anytime something that means a lot of people is treated like a flat out infected burden that someone wants to carve off and leave for death, people get emotional and upset.

I know subeta is called a petsite, but it hasn't felt like one for a really long time. And to be told your issues, mostly pet related, are bottom of the barrel and probably about the most unimportant thing that could be fixed on the site.. well. It kinda feels like you slammed a door in my face and told me to spend my money elsewhere, which is how I personally reacted and is why I have often found myself wondering why I'm still here. I'm sorry if it sounded like I was yelling, though.

Now I'm done for reals though.

Honestly, I don't feel the first year should get a loyalty box. Sticking it out for a year doesn't show loyalty - don't take this the wrong way I understand how hard the first year is. It's just showing loyalty should take years not a year.

With that said though I don't feel it would be a bad idea that in the first year you could get something. Some sort of recognition for all the hard work you spent on your account. I don't know, maybe I'm just taking the fact that the boxes are called loyalty boxes too literal.

As somebody who's coming up on close to 10 years on the site, I have to agree.

Subeta's not great at keeping newbies around with its current situation and a small reward for staying on the site for 1 year would be grand. A forum title, or another small token of appreciation would be a cute way of saying "thanks for sticking with us and here's hoping you'll stay a while longer!". A loyalty bag, maybe? When opened, you'd get a set of loyalty-themed items (food, plushie, beanbag, sticker, book, wearable). Concerning Keith's "you don't deserve something special for staying around for a year" statement - make these bags sellable. Unlike the loyalty boxes, the bags would contain no special long-term-loyalty perks, so I see no obvious reason for having them tied to your account.

Also keeping my fingers crossed that us longtime users will get a bit of a perk for staying on Subeta for a whole decade. That's not a small amount of time to spend on a site and I do have pretty high expectations for this year's anniversary festivities. Though... I probably shouldn't hold my breath considering that we've yet to see any word about the Peka-Boo battle-of-the-bands rewards. :'D

Edit: Agreeing with Andrea on the bits about the pets. I know it's hard trying to figure out ways to make pets more interesting right now, but if it wasn't for the pets, Subeta wouldn't be where it is right now. This place didn't start out as a pixel doll dressup site and while "pet people" are a smaller percentage of users on the site, it doesn't make us any less important.

I'm happy to see more people mentioning and agreeing that the first year should have at least a little something ❤️ Since the whole newbie experience is getting reviewed, it's the perfect time to bring up all possible aspects we think could get better c:

yes newbies want cookies too, even if theirs doesn't come with frosting or chocolate chips XD

A loyalty bag would be great too! Tradeable or not, doesn't seem to matter as much to me in this particular case, it's really more about the intention behind it ^_^

Even if the 10th anniversary festivities aren't too different from the usual, it would be fantastic if there was some sort of meta loyalty achievement that included having 10 of the regular ones o: (so people would get something else on top of the LB!) 10 years is so long, omg. I can't even imagine, but I guess as long as Subeta is up I should get there someday xD

(Rah said they were working with the winning band to design some of the prizes, so maybe that's why they're delayed! I still have hope for some great things to come alksjksjf )

As someone who's only been around about two years, I honestly think one year anniversaries should get some kind of marker. It doesn't have to be a full-on loyalty box, but definitely something. Like frost said, a small bag or a forum title or something would do it.

(And while this part of the conversation is more or less done I would like to say that referrals are stupid and should go away. I don't know people and if I did I wouldn't be like 'hey girl wanna join a petsite'.)

Yeah, I think a loyalty bag might possibly be the best solution if staff isn't interested in giving away Cash Shop items as rewards. xD It's not quite a loyalty box, but it'd still be a little token of appreciation for those who stuck around and I'm pretty sure a lot of people would like getting something like it for staying on Subeta, as buggy and laggy as it tends to be.

I can only speculate on the 10th anniversary achievements and rewards, but I'm really itching for that loyalty box. :'D Having too many pets on Subeta is simply not a thing that exists. Ihaveaproblem.

Thanks for letting me know about the Peka-Boo rewards still being in the works! c: I wasn't stalking Rah's posts and it's been a good while since the event finished, so I figured that somebody either forgot, or that they're waiting to iron out the details with the new achievement system before pushing the rewards out.