You can post images on subeta but you need to upload them to a separate site (which then you have to obtain the image url from) and that is quite a bit more difficult. Also it makes the image publicly available in a way that it isn't in discord - it's only available to you and the person you're sharing it with in discord.

And it's only possible to have public discussions or discussions in a group you've joined in subeta on forums, whereas in discord you can have private threaded discussions (like a chat on a smartphone, you go back and forth replying to each other).

haha yeah, it's a lot! fingers fall off

It's hard to motivate onself to do big events like subetabox, and very expensive. I'd love to see more smaller events, meet-and-greet type threads, things with less commitment. There have been some good suggestions on this thread that I'm going to try and collect together. ^^

Speaking of events, maybe some kind of ping group for planning them would help - do you think your CW Event Artist ping would be suitable, or should that remain just for events that need artists to draw items? I can make a new one, no problem, just trying to sort out things in my head.

RE: mentoring Yeah – right now there's just not a good way to initiate, and it doesn't seem like it's really worked out, even though you're very willing! I've personally helped a couple of people, and also never saw them again ahaha. But I'd like if something was there, visible, somewhere. I'll have to think on it. If it makes you feel better, I think your CWhelp thread has really helped a lot of newcomers (and oldies like me, too! Over the years)

That's a great idea! Would you be interested in posting something like that on the discussion forum, or would you like me to?

Good luck!

This is some great insight, I had thought that the process for getting a copy of a cw on the forums was a bit confusing, but not incomprehensible - but maybe I need to dig deeper from an outsider's perspective. put together a guide for new buyers a couple of years back here that explains the whole process pretty in depth, I'd love it if you had a chance to review it and see how well it explains things. It's stickied in the discussion forums, but even if it is useful, it may be hard to find for new/curious people.

I see what you're saying about shop search still not integrating CW shops perfectly! I think you have grounds for a great post in the suggestions forum for making the process of buying from a CW shop via shop search simpler.

Oooh, I see! Well, thank you again for your comments and helping me understand your experience of things. :)

I remember someone (sorry I can't remember for sure if it was kuma/atticus or Stakely... ?) talking in discord about you helping with one of the first CWs that kept getting rejected and I am sure I remember you being a huge help. So I think your efforts have worked at least once ❤

thank you and I will look over that faq/intro. I read a few such and found them - helpful, to an extent, I mean I have managed to buy quite a few CWs as you can see from my current HA (I bought the cat and the dress I'm now wearing from signing up on the CW forums). But it's been a rocky path. At least one time I think the person on whose thread I signed up was irritated at me for doing so (this was , who has since been very nice to me, but I guess didn't know me then) who said pretty much 'I guess you can have one since I said it was public even though I didn't ping you' :sweatdrop: in response to my request to buy the wig... I had spotted the item somehow, I think through friend feed when a friend signed up for it? I don't recall. But it definitely made me wary of using that 'slot' method of buying CWs from strangers for a while...

(the other cws I have on, I bought the clouds and shoes in discord I think, or got linked from discord to a thread, possibly; I got the hair and the sparklies in the cw pawn shop... I got the earrings from a contest win or raffle I think? )

Oh, it's not true that you won't miss releases if you're in all the threads, because some things sell out within an hour, and it's absolutely impossible to be on this site 24/7. Unless you're independently wealthy, have literally nothing else to do, and require no sleep.

Stay at home parents and college/grad students have a big advantage over those of us that work 40+ hours a week, but even they miss things that sell out within an hour or two should those things go up for slotting while the kid needs them or they're in class. I miss out on things all the time because they went up for slotting while I was at work--and I am actually usually signed in here while I'm at work, but since I'm actually working in the office, if something goes up while I'm engrossed in a task that takes more than an hour, or in meetings, I still miss it--even if it were possible to get push notifications for certain items, I may not be able to do anything about them if I'm busy and a break is hours away.

I'm just popping in here, haven't read a ton of comments but some of these are YIKES. For people saying you can't have a job/life and be able to buy CWs... Dude. Everyone's life is different yes, but even working 40+ hours a week I was able to get what I wanted or hunt down things thanks to friends. Even things that have been on my wishlist for literal YEARS I've somehow managed to get my hands on, it's crazy.

My opinion on batch limits, it's honestly up to the releaser what they're comfortable with. Not everyone is comfy with slotting people and hate putting things in their shop and want 10 copies and be done with it. Cool. They're allowed to do it. Am I bummed? Sure there's a time where one might get bummed for missing out on "elusive" things, but with the batch limits also brings into play the private/public opinion on stuff. People are gonna miss out. It's bound to happen. Even with 24-48 hour releases that are unlimited I still sometimes get someone coming at me upset they missed out. It comes down to a you can't make everyone happy so do what honestly works for you.

I personally have always had a philosophy of:

• Tribute item? Make it unlimited so everyone can have.
• Basic item? Gauge interest, maybe 20-30 copies.
• Personal/sentimental items? Enough for the people I want to have them.

But with that... That's ME I don't expect people to follow my own little guideline. Like I said before you do you and what you're comfortable with.

woah there buckaroo, I don't think that attitude was necessary - and clearly you missed the entire point of the last part of my post... though considering how you replied, I think I might know why you miss so many items in a community that values manners and genuineness. have a lovely day!

Those of us that stay at home with kids or go to college/grad school quite often put in way MORE than 40 hours a week because we don’t get to clock out and go home after our shifts. They don’t end. To see people actually insinuating raising kids or getting a degree isn’t work is DISGUSTING.

I love the purpose of this thread trying to get insight with the community but this kind of comment is NOT a helpful and I am honestly disgusted.

Even with my so called “advantage” I miss out on MANY items I want, but I don’t whine and cry about it.

Honestly... the amount of drama this is stirring up is scary...

Nevertheless, Thank you for trying to help the CW community a more welcoming place and giving us a place to see what we can do to improve our shops <3

I’m not a well known releaser so would you be so kind. Sorry.

Just my two cents here. I’m very, very guilty of capping my items at 2 batches max. Mainly that’s because I’m lazy. Sure I could make fancy ass spreadsheets to track all the people asking for slots but I simply don’t have the time. I have lesson plans to create, supplies to buy, bills that I gotta pay, a young cousin I now have custody of, trying to survive on an island run by thieves and incompetents. Easier to gather names of ten people that want the item and then submit it to get it onsite.

In short, I don’t have time to log so many slotters. I’m sorry if this makes my item unavailable to some, but those items when sold should go for slot. And they do get sold because I’ve seen them for sale. Plus there isn’t a guarantee that an item will fill, keeping a lower batch amount helps control that, at least for me. People can always message me to ask for a pre-slot if they know they love a certain item. did that with the cozy bunnies which is why I make sure to save a slot for her each time I release a new one. She will let me know if she is interested or not and I’ll adjust the slots accordingly.

I think with DTS, the submitter should get at least one copy of the item for free. As it stands now, you pay for the cost of the submission then you have to pay for a copy for the artist and yourself. That’s a rip off IMO.

IRT private’s, the only ones I have are ones that hold sentimental value for me example being calico stuff. But buyers are always free to sell the item back to me if they aren’t happy with it anymore.

If this rambles too much I apologize. Had one too many mimosas today :/

I don't have much to say except you are a lovely, patient bean and I love that you're trying to start these discussions civilly :)

i understand that some users are disappointed when they miss items, but... honestly, in the last like 8 months, i think i've only missed out on 2 cws i really wanted because of the limits. and i've been able to acquire them since then because higher demands = bigger batch limits, more copies floating around after they've sold out. so i'm curious what items, and how many items, you've missed that you feel particularly jaded on this topic.

at the end of the day, if someone wants to prioritize cws over other things in their life, that's their prerogative. everyone has stuff going on in their life, whether they're employed, studying, a stay-at-home mom or whatever else. i'm positive that i have more freedom at my desk job than a stay-at-home mom or a student. even thinking back to when i was in college, i worked 20 hours a week and was a full-time student. i didn't have the time or money for cws at that time, so i certainly wouldn't have been at an "advantage." on top of that, this shouldn't be viewed as a competition? not sure where the aggression is coming from or why. other people getting slots on cws you want, even if it prevents you from getting those slots in the short-term, benefits you in the long-run. but also like just be disappointed for yourself, dont be angry at other users for being around when you aren't. on top of that, the level of entitlement? no one owes you anything. you aren't owed any cw, or any item. no one is under an obligation to make cws available for you. they're custom wearables. someone paid for that art and they are allowed to do whatever they want with it when it's on site.

one of the things that i like the most about the cw situation on subeta right now is that i can choose exactly how many items i want to release. i can choose who gets them. if it's something sentimental to me, i can choose whose hands it lands in. i paid for the art, i paid to submit it. why shouldn't i control who can have copies of it? also, generally staff is very understanding about creating items similar to those that have been out of circulation a long time. i think that cws need a lot of work, but i don't think this is one of the places that is suffering the most. if there were more active members, more batches would fill and more would enter the market.

I'm not the person you pinged, but since I started the thread, I'm going to reply and read between the lines of your post to say that because of your RL constraints/not being able to check subeta frequently, you would support larger batch sizes/longer slotting period.

Personally, most of my releases have slots open for at least a full 24 hours before they fill, usually I ping various groups over the course of a few days. I don't think I've ever personally had anything fill in an hour, but for more popular re leasers I'm sure it's happened. For releases that you've noticed filling suuuuper quickly, maybe it would help to send a short, nice comment to the releaser to ask about pre-slotting on future colors or request a larger batch size on future recolors?

Thanks for popping in, I appreciate the comments. :) I definitely support releasers doing what they feel most comfortable with, I guess it's just a desire to find some balance with the “audience” of buyers that want to have access to things that inspired me to start this thread. I would never presume to tell anyone how they should release their items or run their shop! But I had hoped some discussion might cause releasers to put a little thought into their systems that they might not have before, – like me, since I'm learning a lot! XD

I like your system! I haven't done a tribute item yet, but I think that would be a nice way to release them.

ahhh I'm sorry for drama, but thank you for the kind words and I really did intend this to be a civil and welcoming discussion for everyone!

That's okay! If you don't feel comfortable doing it, I'll try to get a post together soon. Thank you for the inspiration! :)

I'll take those two cents, hahaha! Ramble away! :P You're not the only person in this thread to talk about how they purposefully use a lower cap. No worries, everyone has their own system and reasoning and I'm not here to judge, just understand. :) I also find slotting to be a pain at times, and I don't have nearly as much going on as you!

I think it's really nice of you to offer pre-slots for people that have approached you, like Lyonesse. Maybe you could mention your willingness to do that in your shop rules, so if anyone is afraid of missing out, they could ask you privately about pre-slotting on future items? That would be one way to mitigate anyone that's after your items but keeps missing them.

As for DTS, submitters do get one copy for free, and then the item is placed in their shop, but you still have to buy a copy for your artist. I think DTS needs to be seriously overhauled, though, because it is really only useful if you're just trying to get an item on site and don't care at all about making a profit...which is the opposite of most cw releasers I'm sure!

T____________T Thank you, this has become a bit much but I'm trying!

Thanks for joining in on the discussion! I have really appreciated all the conversation on your thread in the feedback forum, that's what inspired me to make this post.

I am not personally jaded about low batch sizes, but I've grown tired over the years of the constant complaints by some users about how "stingy" the CW community is with our releases, whether they be private or friends-only or whatever. Like you, I've had my chance to buy more than enough cws over the years, and I personally don't sweat things that I've missed, because there will always be something new and beautiful to catch my eye. I created this thread with a HOPE of opening some discussion with other releasers about batch limits and accessibility, always with an eye on potentially making the cw market more welcoming and friendly to outsiders/the rest of the site.

Maybe I'm being overly generous to the people on site that complain about not being able to get all the CWs they want, because I'm sure a lot of the saltiest complaints are coming from a sense of entitlement that isn't deserved. I firmly believe that as long as CW releasers put their time and money into their releases, they should be able to do whatever they want with them – whether that's to release 100 copies or only 1 to keep themselves.

I don't know what on earth I said to upset you so much; I could apologise if I did, but I'm completely confused.

It's just not true that people don't miss slots on things they really want--not when some things sell out in less than an hour or two. It wasn't meant to be a personal attack.

But I'm pretty sure that if people didn't want me to buy things, I wouldn't be getting the pings, which is an entirely different issue than getting the pings and finding that something's sold out in 1-3 hours.

You're absolutely right!

That is not what I meant at all. I'm quite aware that being in school is work and I'm sure you work many more than 40 hours a week with your family; and I am very sorry that it came across like that. What I meant is that people who work outside the home (particularly if they work long hours) have less control over their schedules. I have noticed that things I miss out on are usually things that are released during the middle of most people's workdays.

sorry -- you're such a sweetheart. i didn't mean that comment directed at you, more at some comments directly preceding mine. i, personally, think that the cw market could be a lot more accessible as well, but i don't necessarily believe that restricted items are the biggest hindrance in regards to this. i think that there are a handful of people in the community who have sort of a bad attitude about the cws they aren't able to get, but the audience i'm more interested in reaching is the people who are completely outside of the community entirely and making cws more accessible to them. i agree wholeheartedly that people should be able to do whatever they want with their items, whether that's keep one copy for themselves or release 100. i think that there are two issues, 1) people who feel entitled to any cw that is released, 2) the untapped market of subeta players who don't participate in cws. i think that there are a lot of things that subeta could do better that would help contribute to more users being invested in the cw market, and i think that we do need more members drawn to more parts of subeta in general. i think that having these discussions is really valuable and important, but some people just sort of tend to miss the point and use them as an opportunity to complain about missing an item when that is sort of... not the point. i think that it's an issue with some amount of toxicity and also just generally... some people, you won't be able to change their perspective on something. if exclusivity is introduced, whether it's artificial or not, they will feel slighted if they aren't beneficiaries of the exclusivity. but i do think this is something that can be addressed on a larger scale by staff

I thought I would mention that I did get a cw that I had been DREAMING about this year. I thought it was totally out of my grasp forever but a friend opened up their owned list and they said they never wore it and would be happy to sell it. It was 2k csc I think? I don't remember now how much it was, but it was worth it to me because it was one of my top 3 FAVORITE ALL TIME NEVER GOING TO GET cws. So I think like you said if you look around and are willing to wait you can get any item that is released at some point. I suppose unless it is private/exclusive but you know you can always wl it too and maybe you can get added into that group at somepoint and maybe someone in that group will put an item up because like the item I bought they never wear it. :)

Thank you for saying this. I admire your efforts on replying to every one who offered their opinions. Every year we have this sort of discussion and it always gets diverted to complaints of privates and exclusivity from people I've never seen in cws. I too am sick and tired of these complaints. Honestly, I don't have to ping my public group at all for my items, but I choose to do it for most of my items because I want people to at least have a chance at getting my releases. After reading some of these comments, it became more enticing for me to just release items for my friends or myself only. For those of you who complain, let see you have snarky comments thrown at you when you host a giveaway or a contest. Imagine you trying to be nice and make things available with many copies only to see it being resold for more than double its original price. If you're okay with that, good for you, but understand that some people have limits when they're constantly taken advantage of and belittled at for doing something different. I've been wanting to say this for years. It's honestly getting old.

I think got frustrated because it seemed like you misread what they wrote:

"If you post on someone's thread, participate in their events, chat with them once in a while, join their ping group, etc - you won't miss their items" I think you read that part and missed the part where they explained what they meant (and it wasn't 'if you're on 24/7'):

"someone who asks about my day, who takes the initiative to post a dumb little gif in a thread contest, or who says they like my HA will stick in my mind and if they miss a color or were looking forward to another recolor, 9/10 times I remember that and try to accommodate them."

Basically saying if you're friendly to them enough that they remember you in a friendly way, they'll accommodate you even if you miss the one hour window or whatever. And that's ... not the point you were responding to and it got wires crossed. That's what I think happened...

And I think it's probably not what every releaser does (some people will not give their friends preferential treatment or won't consider people who complimented their HA once and posted a few gifs and asked how they are to be friends; but I really do think some people will do that too. And also I wonder if there's not a lot of projection going on all around where all of us think our own experience is that of most people, even when we aren't very representative.

Here's hoping for less misunderstanding and snapping... we are all potentially part of a community together with common goals of friendship and keeping Subeta going to enjoy into the future!

Thank you .

I do actually do those things. I participate in contests and chat with people and am active on discord. I am pretty friendly I think and I try to be helpful as well. There are some people that I absolutely do not get along with but I think that's true of almost everyone on earth.

But sometimes I still miss things because they sell out in two hours and I was in a meeting or working on something I couldn't pull away from every hour or so to check pings. And if someone's said there will only be x number of copies first come first served, they can't hold something for me no matter how much they might want to.

I don't ever mean to hurt people's feelings in these subeta threads; if I have it's almost always a misunderstanding or sometimes ignorance.

I'm gonna echo batch sizes are something hindered by cost before availability. CWs are just way too expensive, especially for an item you barely have time (if at all) to try on without buying it. And currently all the ways around that involve one party having to pay up. Most of the time when I slot on stuff it's in part because I like it but also in part that I wont get a chance to own it myself if I spend too long deciding. I'm pretty much throwing my chances into the resale market if I dont grab a slot, if lucky I'll see it second hand for slot or just a lil over but.. if not...

When it comes to selling cws that's literally decided on how well the first colour of the line does. More often than not its 10-20 copies. I like cws having a limit for the most part because.. well they're special, they're user created, user submitted items that would be otherwise impossible to see together. I get to make ha's with the work of 10 artists if I wanted to and that's awesome! And weaved in with the many many sp items it's amazing what people come up with. That in itself to me makes them worth more than sp items and worth a higher rarity. Just... not this expensive x____x

The false exclusivity thing that keeps cropping up IS there for a reason and I honestly do understand how it can look from an outsider perspective. CWs from the other side is.. pretty uninviting and if I didn't know better I'd be hard agreeing with a lot of naysayers.

Sadly we're a tiny community, only need a couple bad examples in any one area for everything to look bad from the outside. Whereas the selling side of things is pretty open for the most part( with a lil navigation and reassurance), the reselling market is..pretty awful :/. And for many, that reselling market is one of the first things they see.

I wish there was an easier way to truly see whats out there and available for the newer players but.. without a lot of digging its really hard, in the wardrobe I literally only check out the newest releases so if I go on a break that's god knows how many I wont see or hear of for a long time. And I don't think people should feel obligated to having to log in every day just to keep up with this aspect of the site when there's already so much to do each day.

The lack of schedules a problem too, all too often I've slotted on an item only to have to wait weeks to even hear of it again, even with recolours which is pretty insane to me.

Aaaa sorry , I am typing this half asleep, hopefully I made some sense somewhere #

I awaken to ramble more!*

A few months ago, we had a resurgence of animal booties on site, many different takes on similar themes. What was nice about it was that it brought in a lot of new faces I wasn't familiar with, new artists, and releasers alike. It was almost like that was what was going to bring the community up. Buuuut it quickly fell flat l'D. I'd love to see that kind of community collaboration again with different themes. But without us being able to experiment without that hugeass cost its just.. not plausible for the majority..and that's really sad tbh.

TL;DR there's lots of small things likely keeping new people away and I can understand why but I feel the upfront cost and the reselling market is the two biggest things.

I used to release CW’s however it filled so slowly if not at all. Only my friends wanted to slot so that’s the reason most of mine are private.