Pshhya, who doesn't love a sale right? But to be frank I'd rather see 25-50% off extendables (books, food, redeemables, maybe even potions) and then add back stuff like collections and monthly challengers that users/newer users missed out on or forgot (or didn't need for a TC until 4 months after the fact fml), for full price as the luxury is the chance to buy them again!

Then like, new this sale only stuff like a special doesn't count against your total pet slot, or maybe a black friday challenger (letsdoit) and other expendable collectibles and hair coupons or whatever.

I dunno, I'm kinda with you in the corner of "cool more chick wigs and eyes with lashes and Delish yeshh, just what I didn't want scoore!" |D; I actively buy books, challengers, TCfodder via collection , and then pet slots until I'm capped again. If it wasn't for CWs that go to the TCs then I'd basically be giving subeta all of about $10-20 a month because I cannot count how many cares I have for most of what's in the CS.

Which is sad because as a non-breeder who just got a niceass raise and now has a roommate, like, the money I could waste here. Could.

I love that idea! There are so many times where I've kicked myself for not getting a monthly collection item because I wanted time to earn some sP first, then stupidly forgot I was saving up for something. Then the new months bag shows up and I go "duh!" I get not having them in the shop all the time, but sold for the regular price during a "sale" is a nice option.

Just my two cents, after reading through this thread...

1. I'm impressed by the overall level of civility in the thread. Even when certain users are complaining about (legitimate) issues, they have been doing so in a well-thought out and intelligent manner. That is so rare online, and I hope that everyone here realizes and appreciates that!

2. Despite some concern from users at the beginning of the thread, staff responses have been frequent and detailed. This is another rarity, in large part, online - and I'd like to thank the staff for that.

3. Speaking as someone who has been running a large database for over 10 years (a non-profit environmental organization with over 80,000 active members, and a network of inter-connected/associated tables, forms, DBs, reports, etc)...I understand how hard it is to fix old issues while not interrupting the day-to-day flow. The staff needs to fix everything, and needs to do it in a way where the act of fixing goes largely unnoticed to the average player. For the most part, they are very good at this!

4. The most impressive take-away I have from this thread is the number of things that have been fixed as a direct result of this thread already! If that doesn't give you some hope for the future of Subeta, I don't know what will!

Everything you just said, everything. There is a lot I'd like to see done with sales (so much yes to the opponents returning), but not price cuts on things like pet slots x_X At least all the eyelashiness and girly wigs saves me some cash ;) I'm poor as foop at the moment, but I'm still grateful for the money I can earn through my art on the site, I'd love to put more of it back in but right now I'd be pouring money down a drain and getting nothing back and I can't afford that, or justify it, everyone I know isn't going to be interested in Subeta, have already said 'no' or I met them on here = which sucks because there are two referral items I desperately need and there is nothing else like them on site TTATT

Pre-edit: Apologies in advance if this sounds blunt, it is very likely to :x

Watch as I'm likely to shoot myself in the foot here. Or say something really stupid. Either one or both. (mathematical "or", y/y?)

I agree with Andrea (again, about several different things, haha) when it comes to unretiring things on the sale. Traditionally, unretirements are my favorite part of the sale. Why? Well, because I wasn't here since the creation of the site and thus I've missed a lot of shit along the way -- many of which are really hard to get a hold of nowadays.

Shooting myself in the foot time: I love the unretirements so much I don't even think these items would have to be half off. Hell, they could even be capped (ex. "can only buy up to 3 of each retired MC", similar to what the Hustler has);

Doing it again: I like the idea of "sale especific items", which means sets of items only available to purchase during the sale period, at full price (which could be a friendly price compared to similar items, but not 50% off). The items could and should come back next year / in the summer sale, but wouldn't be available throughout the year.

Now, time to say something potentially really stupid, because I have no idea how much of each thing the CS typically sells. Pet slots and GAs aside, I'm going to bet wearables sell the most, with maybe books selling nicely as well. And then I wonder: does the wardrobe sell more because people love it better, or do people love it better because it sells more? Read this latter "sells more" in terms of availability. The wardrobe might be one of the most attainable big "collections", if not the most attainable, and is surely the most broadcasted one. (Which is why I once suggested account perks as prizes to people who worked on collections, but this is another story.)

I'm not sure if people sometimes fall short of interests and "willingness to give money" or if they could find new interests among the things that already exist, weren't they nearly impossible to achieve. Carol mentioned a few pages ago that Subeta puts an effort towards keeping items attainable to newbies, but... what I see over and over again are people not bothering with collecting plushies, beanbags, cards or even stickers (which used to be the "friendlier" collection in my eyes). I can vouch for that, during every event I buy every single thing in the shops and shove it into my vault in case I ever decide to work on my collections - which I never do, because to me they're also impossible. It IS borderline impossible to maintain multiple interests around here, so, given most of the CS releases are wearables, I can imagine why other types of collectors aren't too interested in purchasing. Of course, these collections aren't too popular, and as such they don't get much spotlight, so they don't sell much, and if they don't sell why make more... it's a circle.

I think I once saw someone mentioning that a few dozen beanbags they needed to complete their collection were more expensive than the rest of it together, not to mention some were utterly impossible to find. Mind you, I don't think any collection should be easy or cheap, but we even have an achievement for completing all of them at some point - it takes me to believe they should be more attainable than they are.

Forgive my frustration at this particular moment, because I can be WAY too negative and pessimistic, but collections serve to me as just another reminder that I haven't been a player of this site for long enough. I don't think there has been one day I didn't get reminded of this, which sadly, as bad as it was, it's a feeling I never had in Neopets. Maybe when I wanted SuAP, or MSPP, or avatars from old plots (equivalent to achievements here), but otherwise not. Here I remember it every time I look at a long-retired beanbag, a long-retired plushie (the pet slot ones, where they are?), or even retired old Delish/Subq. Every time the news post tells me to look for retired Subq in GoFPs, I kinda read it as "well, sorry, you haven't been a member long enough, try your luck with 500 csc maybe" (which, with my luck, is a lolnope).

Again, I don't think things should come easy, but it would be lovely if there were more unretirements, and more often. November and Black Friday could be a nice opportunity for that (as well as other sales), unretire things in the Cash Shop, in the Crystal Shop, maybe make a special restockable shop or a special "high price" shop where things could show up again for a premium or with a certain rarity value. There would be people selling csc and people sinking sP/tokens/crystals/everything. Unretirements are a gift in themselves, they don't need to be any cheaper (on the contrary). Maybe even make events that somehow promote collections too? That's another deal, though.

This might be one of my biggest "pet peeves" in regards to Subeta, and one of the most pungent reasons why I'd have a hard time inviting more people. Even if I started enjoying myself here after a while, it took a LOT of time and effort to get my account to be a bit better off, and I still feel behind SO many times. I can't imagine how it would be for someone brand new. It's like forever running after a train you can't catch. Gets tiring after a while.

Note: I also really dislike how your 1-year anniversary achievement has literally NO gift attached. Not a 1-month GA, not even a thank you bear, nothing. That kinda says "your loyalty is not worth a gift just yet, try again next year maybe". Baffles me because the first year is the hardest.

[edit] Battling could probably do with some tweaks to get more inclusive, but I'm not touching that subject. I definitely don't have enough knowledge to do it, LOL.

I agree with pretty much everything Andrea, and many others, have said.

I absolutely would straight donate to a fundraiser if it meant a better-working site.

That to me would be the payoff. Heck, I've maxed out the loyalty card already, I'd be delighted to be donating to something that would pay off longer dividends in the end anyway.

I absolutely agree with the comments asking that if something needs to be revamped, it would be great if that one thing was worked on until it was done rather than implementing more projects.

I think if you said in a post and on the page what the money was going towards you might be surprised at what people will donate. And you can definitely include incentives. Make a trophy for donating $5 and a avatar for donating $10. Enough to make an impact when many people chip in, but not quite enough that people balk at the expense. Make a few desirable items for higher tiers and make a tempting offer (say help design a pet) to the people who donate several hundred (I don't have a figure for this).

I think a fundraiser might work out better than a daily goal bar to be honest. Jellyneo only has theirs once a month or every couple months. Looking at it stay lower red most days (which I'm sure it will) might make people more concerned about the state of the site. Or keep the bar and make it a monthly goal instead.

Still though even the bar doesn't help with what the real problem is - that we need to raise money in excess of what is currently brought in so a rewrite of the code can finally happen.

Pet page is back to lagging I can see. 35 seconds, nice.... ahem.

Best cash shop suggestion ever kjdlfhdfg PUT THE REFERAL STUFF IN THERE YEAAH! SO PEOPLE CAN EITHER REFER FRIENDS (if they happen to have them) (I do not because I work with 40+ adults and my two irl friends I pretty much met on subeta so lawl fml) OR JUST BUY THEM. Do it please.

Out of most of the posts I feel sttaff need to really sit down and analyze, I feel like your's should be top of the list on this board because it's true. All of it is true.

Unless you're willing to spend all of your waking moments, or willing/capable of dropping an assinine amount of real money, on subeta it is literally next to impossible to have more than one interest. It is ridiculous.

I have spent so so so much money on just: Pets, Books, and Battling. Without real money being involved, just doing one of those things would be a joke. There's no one in hell I could really keep up with a wardrobe, or other collections. It's just not possible. Which is what makes it REALLY really painful (and that's why people create such an uproar) when something has to be changed. Like, the stat cap.

Don't get me wrong, I understand it's original intention (huge gaps, now there's just a huge cap between a collection of pets and 2 pets laugh) but we were literally told: too bad. Go train another pet or find something else to do. Really? Really? After spending god knows how much on books, intel boosters, stat boosters, training, weapons to battle more things to get exp, and get one pet to the point where it can beat (almost.....) everything, just fuck you asshole go train another pet or gtfo. GO TRAIN ANOTHER PET FOR NO REASON BECAUSE EVERYTHING WORTH A DAMN IS ACHIEVEMENT BASED SUCKAA HAhaha.

That's why a lot of large pet owners, are gone. Could they train another pet? Most of us were (I have a capped pet +7 MORE t11 pets + 2 t10s that're closing in on t11.. and a t9) before being told to... but why? So we can cap 30 pets? So I could have even MORE hard work thrown into a brick wall? So, a lot of people left. A lot of people more or less left. Some people log in, battle some, and then call subeta a joke and leave again.

It's so impossibly complicated to keep up more than one focus on subeta, than when the time comes and that focus is culled... well that's why people get so damn upset xD! If we could afford to have multiple focuses, then maybe it wouldn't hurt so bad.

But I think culling the 50% off sales and instead bringing the years collections back (at full price, exactly!) and all the hair coupons and all the vanity and all the delish back (at full price) AND all the challengers back (full price~~) and THEN do some special sale-only items for icing and be done. No more 50% because all that does is make people wait all year which doesn't help the site at all.

I MEAN FRANKLY IF PET SLOTS AND POTIONS AND WHATEVER ARE TOO MUCH AND THAT'S WHY PEOPLE ONLY BUY THEM THEN... THEN MAKE THEN $10 YEAR ROUND, LET US ALL BUY 5 MORE, AND CULL THE 50% BF SALE. Do it. At least people would give the site money year round, then.

...just as I said that, there was a Crystal Shop restock, haha ^_^; I know time is a limiting factor, it's good to know you two are still/always hunting for old lost items! it almost makes me want to go spreadsheet crazy again as well XD

I think keeping a balance between collection attainability and "showcasing" them more (stuff like my suggestion for account perks for the higher tiers, maybe somehow tie it into events, etc) is key for making players more interested in them again and thus allowing for more diversified CS sales c: !

Yeah, I do have more than one interest but... I can't really invest in all of them, haha. x_X I try to read -some- books and I'm working now on gourmet (because hey, one day I'm going to reach 5k even if I don't have all the food, right?!), I sometimes try to train a pet (lol at me saying this) but there's also my wardrobe and if I want to try making monsters or boy HAs one day I can't even sell any of it -dies-

The battle system makes me feel bad because if I keep training, if I trained REALLY HARD FOR REALLY LONG (think of a person putting lots of effort on a thing XD!) then I'll be like... you. xD Which is great in theory but... there's the whole achievement based thing and the "you must borrow the right weapons" which are probably retired godlies. Not that they shouldn't remain retired, but it kinda feels like a huge lack of alternatives? Also it kind of bugs me how there doesn't seem to be so many alternatives for great, versatile, "long lasting" sets in lower tiers too. It's not normally a subject I tackle, because I feel really unknowledgeable, but I guess more could be done in regards to that... the whole "let's earn some cool weapons as we go" cry and all. I guess there could even be stuff sold for csc for extra perks (like the Sentinel?) but idk x:

Oh I know quite a few people who wait for BF to buy their pet slots... haha. At this rate, I'd rather have BF week be "lots of unretirements everywhere week" than just the old 50% thing that seems to be hurting more than doing the site any good :/

damn it, SO many people would buy those notes, although I guess whoever invested in them wouldn't be any happy

Yeah I think everyone has a main focus, and then ... other focuses. Like hardcore battlers vs. intel/weapons, pet people and their TCs of death, etc. It's just hard to go across the board with more than one thing. I mean I guess maybe that's how it should be, but I think everything should be obtainable to a degree.

Like if I suddenly wanted to get into plushies tomorrow, and found out 50 were literally unobtainable I would just, not. Because there's no point. I guess to some degree the cap could be considered the same, but I've alwways supported there being a challenger cap but not a pet cap; if the hardest challenger is aimed at 22k stats with godlies there's no reason I shouldn't be able to train my pet to 50k and beat it with a spork. Me doing that doesn't effect anyone else. Unless they mad because they're pet has 45k stats and they had to use 2 sporks but still that'd be on them not me XD!

As someone who's only got a few books left, I'm not bothered by books being made more obtainable. I'd be disheartened if they went from 150m to, 5m but even 150m to 50m is fine. If someone can literally not buy something, it's not fun anymore. And if it's not fun, why are we here??

... I actually bought TWO copies of every single set of research notes every single month they came out (one to use, one to read to Craig) and I 100% support this happening. So, there. Unless someone who bought three+ copies wants to start some beef with it, then it needs to happen. I'm not saying bring them all back and leave them to rot in the cash shop or anything, but hell yeah during BF!

I would buy referral items from the CS SO DAMN FAST. Yeah I can see me now, going up to some 50+ mechanic like "Hey mate wanna play this game with cute graphical pets?"

Rotf ngl I have flirted with the idea of hitting the Houston streets looking for hobos and offering them $5 and a candy bar to go to the public library with me so they can sign up for subeta and net me a referral point.

Instead I ended up spending 87m on 3 of the books, and I haven't seen a board with anyone offering points so I can buy the latest one. I'd MUCH rather just admit I'ma loner who works with adults with kids my age (or older) (I went gallivanting in the middle of nowheresville Texas last week with a 71 year old bad ass who has three kids older than me xD!) and give subeta $1 per refer point ;__;

I do not support making people who are loners suffer because they are loners. But I do support letting us just buy things, instead. Or y'know. Be social and get referral points the old fashioned way.

I definitely agree, especially since collections are something you should technically go after as a whole (see achievement for "owning all the things") and nobody is ever done with them forever as more things are released, etc. It's hard to catch up with ONE interest, catching up with all... I can't imagine xD

That does sound nice! I mean, I imagine borrowing the "right" weapons might not be a big deal once someone is into battling for a long time and knows everyone else, etc, but it does feel disheartening for a random newbie outside, who's just considering whether to get in or not. It's like being told that even when you reach the top, after that long, painful road, you'll still have to rely on others to beat the guys you should be able to. I'm all for friendship and collective effort, but not exactly this way :x The idea that users should be able to compensate for not having been a member since forever / having had other interests before seems only fair to me!

Ah of course, if/when rare things get re-released, they're not meant to lose SO much value... maybe they won't even be buyable, it's more like keeping them attainable at all xD The fact that other collection items disappear after used is definitely what makes wardrobe achievements easier (as they don't poof)... so it kinda requires staff to keep going over and over the rare things x: (which is also why I kinda thought of cyclical bigger re-releases of different rares on November or idk)

XD I love the idea that the whole "let's save up for BF" motto would still be kept but it would essentially be so much better than the actual system~

I do not blame you, I had to stop myself dropping 100mil on a book just to stick it in a TC, let alone the second copy I'd like to read to Saddlebum x_X But seriously [item=Unlikely BFFs: The Totally True Tale] there is NOTHING that specific on the site and I want it for these two (you can just about see the young woman on the main image x_X ) and they mean the world to me and it's eating me up inside that I can't get it. So perfect. Much angst. I'm telling this sob story to anyone who'll listen, oops.

I've managed to 'refer' people, the few people who I actually know who might be interested, who I'm not even friends with anymore and not one of the swines put my name down, of the two people who HAVE put my name down, one didn't even finish the registration properly so I never got that point. And yeah I'm not gonna lie the constant reminder that I'm crap at social interaction isn't much of a feel good factor.

I would be perfectly happy if nothing ever went on sale during Black Friday. If that was just an occasion where retired things came back full price, or exclusive items were available in the CS, I'd spend so much money there. I second the CS challengers coming back for that at full price, too - I bought two of each item (one to read, one to unlock) when they were released monthly, but I wouldn't mind a few more as treasure items and stuff, and to let new battlers get them.

I HONESTLY HATE THAT PET SLOTS EVER GO ON SALE. I mean hell, I paid $50-$60 a slot back when they were first released, and I'd pay that much now. In fact, I'd pay more than that to increase my slot limit... and you can bet your ass that I'm not the only one.

It's hard for most 'pet people' to support the site right now, since there isn't really any cash shop stuff for us to buy. Like , I've resorted to buying CWs for my pet treasures in the past year, because those are the only unique and interesting items I can get for them ever since Costume Trunk production died off. Not hating on the staff here, but more unique/diverse items would be really nice - I have no use for a set of ten recolored hats or another hipster Delish line. |D

ohgod I feel your pain I work in a high-end restaurant, and even with a few co-workers who are 5 to 10 years younger than me, there's no way I'd be able to ask them to sign up for Subeta without feeling reeaaaally awkward. I have honestly considered offering them cash to do it, though. THAT CASH COULD BE YOURS INSTEAD, SUBETA. YOU COULD SPARE MY DIGNITY BY PUTTING THOSE IN THE CASH SHOP. Goddamn referral books. D|

At my current job, I work alone, I OCCASIONALLY see my boss IF he comes down before I leave, then I come home to work on commissions. I talk to my friends online, who are on Subeta, and I talk to my birds, who don't understand computers, then I might go around the pub in the evening and talk with guys twice my age who aren't going to be interested. Then I hide from someone closer to my age on the way home in case they know me #badhistory And I've had no luck via Tumblr, referring is just... not an option for me = I'd spend money, but I won't humiliate myself in public for a couple of items.

The cap kinda made it worse, because you need gods to beat things but the latest and greatest numbers I've seen being tossed around is 3b and I didn't exactly see god owners lining up to sell so r-o-t-f that is literally a deadend currently.

Thankfully in the lower tiers it's pretty easy to get some good weapons (outside of tier6-7.. those are kinda hng) thanks to the cash shop challengers. It's really the cap/gods that've yet again made a muck of things, but hopefully the cap will be raised and the pressure for gods will tone down and it'll be okay xD!

Yeah I don't think rare things need to be devalued entirely, but outside of the gods (which are unobtainable because they kill the system) nothing needs to be unobtainable. Especially things that're easily turned into collections and removed from the site, especially cash shop related things.

Yeah I would definitely be going through all the past collections around November that's for suuuuuuree! Searching for all the things I forgot I buy, or didn't need then but need now and can't find. I'm sure subeta would get a cool $30 out of me in just old collection items I missed, everything else aside.

There's so many things in the referral shop other than the books that I'd really love (those adorable plushies included omg) but oh god those were bad enough kjdfhgdfg And I still need another book ;_____;!!! dkjfhgdg I would be so so happy if I could just get those referral points for a buck a pop, so many things I'd have in my life.

I somehow have like 4 referral points? Three people I don't know who must have known an Andrea, and then my mom XDD! Yeah yeah everytime there's new referral items my first thought is "fu2 subeta", because wow yeah I have no friends and I was totally hip with being a recluse until you rubbed it in my face and all ffff.

SEE SUBETA. THERE'S THREE PEOPLE RIGHT HERE RIGHT NOW WILLING TO BUY REFERRAL ITEMS WITH MONEY BECAUSE WE'RE NOT SOCIAL.

... if and I end up dying in the streets of Houston while trying to solicit homeless people to join for referral points, let it be known I'ma hunt down in the afterlife and ruin his life.

That is essentially how I feel about referrals. I'm not saying the idea hasn't crossed my mind briefly, because shame is an entirely foreign concept to me... but I enjoy the respect of my co-workers (despite driving a Transformer car and talking about geeky crap all day) annnddd I'd really like to keep it that way, frankly. |D

Subeta, I'm serious. I have expendable income. Let me expend it on you. 8(
how do I grammar

I am totally down to haunt Keith forever if we die trying to get referrals from homeless people for books for our fake pets to read on the internet. This will be on Ghost Adventures in a few years and the mediums will be like I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT THEY'RE TRYING TO TELL ME, THEY DIED TRYING TO BUY BOOKS FOR THEIR DOG??

I WAS READING THIS IN ALL SERIOUSNESS AND THEN

I mean just look at their faces, now imagine them haunting Keith XD

AHAHAHA 8D pls dont die tho!

[edit] Omg after reading 's post I totally imagined a Houston meetup where everyone goes mob-style after homeless people until they all sign up for Subeta because everyone needs referrals, ROFL. I clearly need to go to bed early today XD