how likely is it though that every single page of those 18 pages was just over the dragon revamp? Id say maybe half of em were only over the dragon....regardless, its done and they arent gonna change it. so Id say just get over it and move on..Im really not trying to be rude(if it seems that way)...and people may spend real money on here, but noone is holding a gun to your head saying you have to..
looney lupe girl, why were the sheeta, tigrean, otter, terracoon etc forced to have polls, and had to be approved by users, but not the dragon? I don't know, as stated the art is nice and all, but how hard would it have been to add whiskers? That was the biggest complaint of all.
Again, even with the timezone argument, you're suggesting that less than 1% of users live in the same timezones as each other.
The majority of users are in America, which only has 4 major timezones.
Logical? No.
not only are users in different timezones, also some only have an allocated amount of time given by parents. meh.
We don't expect everything to have a poll, just the drastic changes and anything that there is a big fuss over. Complaints on the dragon were voiced in the news comments, in the forums, and on NC. I'd think that would qualify as a big fuss. And before anyone says that always happens or something to that extent... the dragon complaints got its own board on NC which spanned atleast 18 pages. I didn't keep track of any complaint boards in the forums, and I don't recall the number of comments the news post got, but 18 pages is a lot for a revamp.
XD I HIGHLY doubt there are 140,000 people on this site a day. I would think at most, half of that.
I can complain if I want- I spend real money on this site, I'm a customer, and I don't agree with the services they give in return.
It's called having empathy for those that DO own a Dragon, that HAVE felt betrayed over the last month by the staff.
Quote:
; border: 1px solid ; font-family: georgia; font-size: 10;">If we have 140,000 active users, why is the maximum amount of people on at any given time less than 1200?perhaps because not everyone can be on at the same time, as they are not in the same time zone as subeta?
Tiki not EVERY revamp ever done has had a poll to go along with it... Not everyone is gonna be happy with every pet revamp thats just part of life... Yes I do complain at certain times but it is always of a pet I have already or one of my fav pet types .. and I am grown up enough to admit it... The artist and staff do the best they can but like I said not everyone is happy 100 percent of the time... Seriously if you don't have the said pet type then why complain about it..
1200 is 0.8% of the total userbase. Are you saying that no more than 1% of users live in the same timezone anywhere in the world?
Other than time zones, Tiki?
well I personally dont recall reading anywhere that everything done on the site had to have a poll, so users could bash things down by not giving constructive criticism(and yes it has happened before) Ive seen it alot actually.
Also, re: the fact that we have 140,000 users...
Do you not take into account how many are inactive? If we have 140,000 active users, why is the maximum amount of people on at any given time less than 1200?
Ah, great, hey Keith! What's the extent of your opinion on all of this?
Personally, I feel the Dragon revamp was handled very unprofessionally, which is a shame because this site continues to get better each month.
If Keith truly was out of the loop and DNA/Luxe/whoever did the Dragon simply stubbornly made the revamp on their own without consideration of a poll like EVERY other recent revamp.. that lacks class.
And yes. ASk noirraven. if we froze people for not having my opinion... 
It wasn't my intention, and I was under the impression we WOULD be making a compromise. I talked to the artist, among others, who said they WOULD be taking into account, and changing it.
Clearly, I'm not as in the loop as I should be.
the thing about what keith said though..is everything can change on a whim..nothing is set in stone except the rules of the site. thats pretty much anywhere you go..granted he mightve said that, BUT during a meeting the choice couldve changed to not do that. shrug regardless Ill stand behind the staff on the revamps until I see one that wholeheartedly doesnt do anything for me..but so far everything Ive seen change has been for the better.
Vari, Keith goes to Neocolours, apparently. Perhaps his inbox there is not full? I'm not entirely sure if/when he reads his profile comments.
Quote By DNA:
; border: 1px solid ; font-family: georgia; font-size: 10;">We were willing to compromise, And I -personally- tried asking for opinions on what needed work. You, the users who put forth the arguments, were not willing to settle. Therefore...it is staying as it is.
I don't remember ever seeing a poll asking for opinions. Or a statement in the news asking for feedback on what we would like to see happen. There may have been a statement made in news comments to this effect, but if so not many people would have seen it before it was lost I would think. And the Forums aren't a good way to get messages across either as I and many others very rarely browse there. Without an official statement in the news, how are we supposed to know that you want specific feedback?
There were numerous suggestions and feedback on the news comments from the little I read of them though so I don't understand how that isn't "the userbase not willing to settle."
I personally don't want to edit my pets' images on account of ethics... or something like that. Changing the image would mean that I could practically just make them a special color when they really aren't, but that is against the rules. So paying $10 to make Lorek an angelic dragon would be a major waste of money just so it would say he's an angelic dragon instead of a common one on his page. Otherwise, I'd be in violation of rules (or atleast I'm sure I'd be) and it just wouldn't feel right at all.
Personally I am not a Dragon fan but these plushies I find to be VERY cute and well draw.. My hubby is a huge dragon freak and even he is happy with the way they look.
"Not to mention the idea that we'll freeze you for stating a contrary opinion is preposterous. When in the history of Subeta has this happened? Don't you think there'd be a lot more frozen users if it was true?" ...Lol Yep My wife would be one of the first frozen..well then it'd be myself and her since we route out internet Lol. Thats why I like subeta more-so than any other pet site. We are free to voice opinions, and the only thing we get back is a response, xD.
We certainly will. Do you have a way we can contact him? Does he manage to read his comments? I know his inbox is full, probably from his cute youtube things.
the only way I could see someone who voiced their opinion getting frozen was IF it was so blatantly rude and full of foul language that the staff would just freeze to get such a foul mouth off the site..but in the entire 2+ yrs Ive been on this site, I have never seen nor heard of someone who voiced their opinion getting frozen over it.
Again. Why keep repeating yourselves here? Take it up with Keith.
Oh I know staff doesn't freeze on a matter of opinion. I just know people who are overly cautious like that.
I love the Nuclear and Dark Matter Dragon Plushie, but I'm still hoping for a re-revamp of the actual Bloodred Dragon :/ I know I could just repaint my Caldera or change his species, but I've had him that way since I bought my first Bloodred Potion ages ago and I don't have the heart to change him after this long.
Quote By "Keith":
; border: 1px solid ; font-family: georgia; font-size: 10;">Right, which we've said over and over, we're working on fixing the dragon situtation.We've worked hard (especially on the last revamp, and we plan to do the same thing right now, with this otter) to keep everyone happy with all the revamps that are coming up, or ones that we've done recently.
We're also planning to have the dragon changes done soon, and a poll added for them.
That is word for word what Keith said on Neocolours. He promised us a revamp, it never came. I agree with the person who said it he said it to shut everyone up then hope it would blow over. That may not have been his intention then, but it certainly feels like it now.
I dunno..Ive been debatting on what to make my 10th pet now anyways..I was originally gonna get a dm aerie with a darkwing...but Ive seriously been thinking of either a gy endeavor or a rb/gy/galactic paralix..just so I have both sides of the dragon family covered. when I first got my dragon, I thought it lacked a little muscle tone..and this revamp changed that and I adore it now. I wouldnt change him back now even if I was given the option.
Not to mention the idea that we'll freeze you for stating a contrary opinion is preposterous. When in the history of Subeta has this happened? Don't you think there'd be a lot more frozen users if it was true?
Well, Sophi..when people dislike something here, they certainly let us know on no uncertain terms, don't they? 
I think it's safe to say that that's a fair judgement.
And Minno--if the main thing you want on the Dragon is whiskers, why not add them to your own? That's the beauty of Subeta; we allow you to edit your own pet's image however you like and post it accordingly. The default images we provide are not all you are allowed to use to represent your pets, which is something many people either seem to forget, or refuse to take advantage of. And no, it doesn't require your being an artist--if you can't do it yourself, Subeta is chock full of users who would be happy to help you with that.
Quote:
; border: 1px solid ; font-family: georgia; font-size: 10;">I also have to say that Keith shouldn't have said anything if it was still up in the air.
I most certainly have to agree with this one.
I thought that's what polls were for, Luxe. They are there for people who don't like to speak up in comments give their opinion. If I remember correctly the dragon never got a poll, so it's not surprising all of this fuss has continued.
Bloodred, nuclear, and darkmatter! Cool, four more plushies for me to collect! xD
Thank you, DrakenLord. I am not saying I do not value their opinions and input on our art. I can be seen quite often frequenting their forums. But it seems to me, after looking at the math, that it would be a step backwards in terms of pleasing the majority of users, to cater to such a small group. It's a hard realization that both DNA and I have come to, along with the rest of the Creative Department.
I think some of that percentage of users who aren't complaining might A. not have a dragon and so are applying that "just won't get one" attitude, B. just got rid of theirs and left it at that, or C. are afraid to say anything because they're convinced it'll get them frozen.
personally there has been very little revamp wise that Ive been disappointed in. I have loved the fact that the artwork is becoming better and better..
ah thats cool dna..cant wait to see them 
I agree luxe. Id be amazed if even half the number you stated on nc is active, on there or here.
Quote:
; border: 1px solid ; font-family: georgia; font-size: 10;">Just because people AREN'T saying anything doesn't mean they like it, I'd just like to point that out.While this is true, staff cannot be responsible for their choice to not speak up. If it bothered them enough, they'd make it clear, don't you think? We can't sMail everyone individually to gather feedback.
I really love the new plushies that have been coming out, but they look more like minions and not plushies. I think it's because they are lacking the stitching that the old version of the plushies had. Either way, they are cute and the art is great. =)
Just because people AREN'T saying anything doesn't mean they like it, I'd just like to point that out. I also have to say that Keith shouldn't have said anything if it was still up in the air. It makes it seems like he only said it to get people to shut up and hoped it would blow over. 
So all-in-all I only have 2 more plushies to gather? Niice I thought darkmatter wasn't being classified as "new" xD. I searched the shop search in every color I didnt have. Lol Woohoo less=more in my case (more sp not spent xD) .
But these are subeta pets, not real life animals/mythical creatures. Wouldn't it be more interesting to add a creative perk like whiskers onto a western dragon? Why should it be bound to that generalization anyway? Why can't it just be special like that?
The beanbags will be following suit very shortly, yes. I was tempted to do them today too, but I've done a lot already. XD
The powers that be of the Creative Department determined that the Dragon needed an attitude change to distinguish it from the other solemn, quiet dragon pets on site. There was no poll because we knew the change that we deemed necessary would not be well-received, but it was necessary nonetheless.
A few of you want to see numbers, and I think it bears saying that right now on Subeta we have almost 138,000 users. Neocolours users maybe makes up 150 of those, and that's being generous. If even 40 of those are regular posters, I will be amazed. As much as I like some of them, they don't even represent 0.11% of our userbase, and yet we are expected to fall over ourselves trying to please them, simply on the premise that they are more vocal.
It seems to me that the 99.89% of our users who aren't complaining are happy with our work (even if they aren't as vocal with praise as NC is with critiques), and those are the users we need to please.
dna- I had a feeling that mightve been the color, since there wasnt one like that in the original set pokes gallery has all but the newest ones...any ideas on the beanbags getting an overhaul, or can you not say? lol
the thing with whiskers though, is this..western dragons(which the dragon pet is apparently based off of) did NOT have whiskers.. the eastern dragon(paralix) is the only dragon to ever have whiskers, granted that could be wrong, but I read alot about mythology and what not..so I dont believe it is.
I suppose I can tell. Third one is marsh. (and I almost put it in the news post, but I really wanted to show off the BR, DM, and Nuclear..but it is an awful lot of black, isn't it?)
personally Ive had a dragon pet since around day one of my joining the site..I liked the old one, but I like the new version better..same with the plushies the new version of the plushie is alot better. the one thing I dont know is whats the 3rd color mentioned in the news post? thats normal, bloodred, nuclear and darkmatter..normal and bloodred already existed..whats this 3rd mystery color? lol
Ok Tiki I understand where you are coming from.. and yes I agree on some note that some of the way things are handled on here and not handled in the best way..... And as for the dragon people.. Like I said earlier my hubby is the biggest dragon freak you will ever meet and he happens to be happy with the way the dragons look .. So I dunno ... I guess certain people just don't like the way certain things look..... Wait I thought this news topic was about the plushies how did everyone get so side tracked