The favorite did win though. The blob was purely a gift but for some reason it's the thing people are upset about.

That's not what I'm saying at all. I know there are some users that aren't happy about the blob winning and they expressed why, but 99% of the actual criticism was directed towards the structuring of the poll.

The only thing I'd change is to show the totals throughout the contest to promote more donations so people could see how far behind or ahead they are. Other than that, I don't mind seeing something that isn't a straight popularity contest or item drive. I don't think it's unfair to have this be based on sP though. I don't want all decisions to be made this way or for this to be done often, but for this, I think it worked.

I'm really glad you're happy with the result, and it is reassuring to have the staff say that this structuring was mainly a character-driven approach, but looking back into the comments on the news post there are so many people who feel that their voices didn't matter. In my opinion, it was a mistake to have an sP sink like this for voting on experiments. In terms of sP it was a success but so many users felt hurt (legitimately hurt, not "butthurt") that repeating it would be completely ignoring their complaints and outright catering to the richer users. Not that I think that's what happened this time. To be honest, l think this is a good learning opportunity for everyone involved and if there's ever an sP sink again I hope it's for something slightly less important, like a new color or something event-specific

So how about the staff release all the donation and individual vote numbers for each option? Did Blobbo actually have the second most individual votes, or did it get there based on sP sunk into it?

Really, though, we need to look past Blobbo, and more at blatant sP sink and how that is actually unfair to people who don't have beaucoups of sP.

Choice of a new pet feels like it should be more of a popularity contest than a money contest. Again, though, if the staff would have posted the actual numbers so people could see the vote and money standings, I think that would have helped from the get go. It might seem minor to them, but clearly it has created an issue.

If this were a straight vote, the winner would have been the same. Would that have changed anything really? I still think people would have been upset. There are over a thousand users with more sP than third place gained in total though. To me, it just looks like a lot of users didn't want to spend sP, not that they couldn't.

Blob had the 2nd most sP (ahead of 3rd by over 500m) not sure about unique votes. Again though, only one pet was promised so making this about the pet that came in second makes it seem less about the format and more a out that pet.

hence why I said we need to look past Blobbo, it keeps coming up in staff posts, which irks me, but I still think that if people could see the actual individual vote counts and sP sunk into each one, it would help people, to an extent. It remains that most people think certain pets wound up where they were because individuals sunk a lot of money into them, because said individuals could afford to, where as individuals with less sP to give did not wind up having equal voice.

I don't care who won, but I get tired of the war of words that starts whenever it is obvious that those with more sP stand a better chance of influencing things than those who do not. There is a disparity in sP between people on this site, but it should not effect major outcomes. (And I am trying so hard not to bring actual politics into this, but so many parallels, it is hard.)

Moral of the story, regardless of what staff does, there will be complaints. It's true that you can't make everyone happy, but I feel like I read a lot of backlash on different events, contests, etc. (I'm not implying that I have never complained about something btw. But some people can get pretty nasty).

I personally don't think this was a battle of the rich vs. the poor. If a person devotes time into Subeta to make millions+ of sP, then they have every right to donate as much sP into their favorite experiment of the five as they please. In the end, it's a voluntary sP sink. Just because we had the option to donate sP, doesn't mean we have to. I have less than 100mil which makes me feel pretty poor, but I only donated 1mil sP. I simply chose that I'd rather put what sP I do have towards something other than throwing it away. However, I don't feel I have an unfair disadvantage compared to someone who has 500mil. I voluntarily chose only to sink 1mil. Plus, I'm just not as motivated to do my dailies to make a ton of sP as other users are. My laziness of earning sP gives me a fair downfall because it's my personal choice not to earn sP to sink. (I may have had more motivation to sink sP if I knew of the totals, however. Even if we got to briefly see the totals for a day that marked the halfway point. Just a couple suggestions).

Ultimately, it was an opportunity to turn an experiment into a pet, which is something staff doesn't have to do. I did go in with the mindset of "I hope the 2759 wins" but it would be cool to have any of the experiments become a full-fledged pet. (Though I'm not wild about the blob still lol but that's personal preference). Besides, you can still try to zap for any of the pets and you can always give an experiment an overlay or artwork.

The problem being, not everyone has the ability to devote time, even if they would like to do so. Do what you like with your money, but some people, as it is in the real world, do not have the same opportunities to do things that others do, so people will still feel left out and at a disadvantage. Again, life is not fair, but fake online worlds can be controlled so that it is a bit more fair.

Regardless of opinions, as Mr. CK says, you don't get to decide that you didn't hurt someone, so all this means diddly, because some people are upset about it, and they have every right to be.

My 2¢ here:

Lott folks keep calling this as some sort of sP sink.

If it's supposed to be? I don't think this intention was successful.

Lotta folks put all their savings in. Whether that was a small amount or a big amount.

Still didn't make much a dent.

I'm one of those small-time buy-ins. I didn't have a horse in this race (none of the options particularly excited me), & I didn't want to dump my sP when I'm saving for a bunch of stuff. So I just "donated" a little to some pets that seemed fun enough, & called it good. The incentives for me, personally, just didn't outweigh my own [somewhat selfish?] interests.

To me, it's like any sP removed from the economy was just a sort of... useful byproduct? of this event. Otherwise it would've more successfully drawn in all those players who could've spent more than the sum totals of the poll donations on their favoured pet(s) & hardly blinked.

Which the posted donation totals don't seem to reflect (& staff answers seem to confirm).

I think as a cute little NPC mini-event, it was neat. I don't know if it was any more successful than as some sort of sP sink--but it was neat. I'm more excited now, though, than I was during. I like seeing everyone being hopeful for their favourite(s), & tossing out ideas for what different concepts/ideas could be for them.

So in summary, sincere thanks for the opportunity this brought about, looking forward to the new pets, but also? I'm sort of just relieved it's over because so many people seem unhappy.

I suppose it helps me that there'll be a different method next time, that there'll even BE a next time for those that lost out--either in voting or in not even being an option--& that we're to see some variety in upcoming pets past these winning experiments. We ARE lacking in that variety.

Maybe letting other folks know those sorts of things (outside this thread I mean) would help soothe some sore feelings? IDK. I don't know if I make enough sense. I hope I don't come across as rude or dismissive, either.

After thinking about it a bit, showing who was leading, if not the exact numbers, might have been the best way to drive up the hype and have people supporting more. The amounts donated seem pretty low to me, I expected a lot of people to be very passionate about which pet won, and support accordingly. There was no good way to tell how much what you were donating measured up against how much might be needed. Overall though the event was clearly a success and a fun event that got me to get rid of some of my sp (it would have been MUUUUCH more if I could have just input donation amounts though), while adding something to the site as well. That's what a little sp sink event like this should be. I don't think users should be ignored if they have less sp. I don't think they were at all, I'd imagine that the distribution of low sp donors is relatively even, and the number of individual users supporting each pet are probably the same order as the sp results or close enough.

tl;dr There were probably some easy ways to get users to sink significantly more into it and have more fun doing so, but the overall idea and event itself was fun and seems successful. Passion and vocal support play a huge role in driving events like this.

So isn't it also unfair if someone who devotes more time into something gets less of a benefit?

We have an event where everyone benefits the same no matter how much effort you put in - the quest-a-thon. I don't mind having variety. Some things are "unfair". That happens though, can't always be fair.

I'm kind of wondering why everyone's assuming we would have gotten these pets if this hadn't been structured as an sP sink.

I don't think we would have. I think this was constructed specifically to take sP out of circulation, and if it hadn't been an sP sink, we wouldn't have been given this option.

I get that a straight vote would have been "fairer", but if the point was getting sP out of the system and this was just a fun way to go about it, the choice actually was "participate in an uneven sP sink or get no experiments turned into pets at all."

It would be, but I don't think this event was that scenario by a long shot.

Quest-a-thons, I think are that sort of event, however. You do one quest and you automatically get a pet slot? Yeah, no. I think that is bollocks.

Yeah I think calling it an sP sink is misleading because that ship sailed a long time ago imo; ever since quest rewards were tweaked a couple of years back sP in has spiralled and this is truly a drop in the ocean. I think a small sP value is just a way of giving your vote some 'weight', because otherwise the only other realistic option is one person, one vote which doesn't seem very... compelling. At least this created a spark within the community.

If sP values had been revealed this thing would have been far more spendy and I don't necessarily think that's a good thing. These things spiral fast and this thread would've been much saltier. Keeping that info concealed is for the best, I think.

Just a couple more (shorter) thoughts that I forgot to mention. (Well kind of...sorry I'm wordy lol).

I do think it was intended as an sP sink. If not, they would've made a simple voting system where you chose one of the 5 experiments. Sort of like, for example, "Do you prefer this Revamped Ontra or the Old Ontra?" that appeared on this poll. (Keep in mind, the 'Current' Ontra WAS the old Ontra at the time). We simply voted for one or the other and then we were done. For this experiment poll, we had to make donations towards our preferred experiment(s) and donate as much sP as we wanted. To me, that sounds like an sP sink.

As to the low numbers, I think it is partially due to comments on the news post and forums. When I was reading which experiments people were voting for in the forums/news, it sounded like most people were voting for the 2759 or the blob (sorry I forget the blob's number lol). At that point, I was like "Okay, my experiment is among the popularity. Therefore, I don't feel like I need to sink a ton of sP" and left it with 1mil. My gut ended up being right since it placed 1st. But I felt no need to sink a ton of sP when I felt like my preference had a good chance of winning. That's in addition with my last post: ultimately any experiment becoming a full-fledged pet is awesome, so I didn't feel like sinking a lot of my sP.

All I was really saying is that not all contests are biased against people who don't have that much time to play subeta. Some are though, but that's the nature of contests. There are winners.

Don't forget - the other experiments are still pets. If someone wants a certain color, custom overlays are great for that. Sure, it won't be "official" and they can be expensive, but if they want one that bad, do quests and save up. They'll get it eventually.

So, had they just released the individual vote count instead of the sP amount, we probably wouldn't be having these conversations.

I saw someone comment that it got 2.5 billion out of the economy, so that person clearly thought it a successful sP sink, but that is such a small amount, it wouldn't make a dent in anything. I still think it is an sP sink, but not significant in regards to how much sP is out there.

no, not all, but clearly enough people feel this one was.

They are, and I have three of them as is, it didn't bother me who won, hence why I put virtually nothing into it, but clearly some people felt very differently. It would just be nice if Subeta would acknowledge those people instead of skimming over the fact. I think they stoke the fire sometimes, inadvertently, yes, but need to then come back and say, sorry, let us explain ourselves better.

I completely agree and that is why I don't really see any issue with fairness. These pets already exist on the site. We've never had any promise of them being converted into new species. That was a bonus for throwing sP away. There are definitely some things I wouldn't want to be handled this way, but experiment pets becoming species? Not that major considering we should have no expectation of that happening anyway AND the pets are here no matter what.

I am 100% here for a 'Choose Oatmeal's Morostide Costume' sink tho.